Thread: Starting it early, 41 ford PU

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hi and welcome from new zealand
lots and lots of good advice here-good to hear you are in it for the long haul cause thats what these projects are!
i too look forward to a dedicated build thread with lots of photo's
if this was my first build, i'd be looking around the wrecking yards or looking for a suitable donor car.
wrecking yards-taking a tapemeasure and looking for a complete frontend that already is setup with steering/brakes/suspension and a rearend with leaf springs/shocks/etc
donor car-with the right car-you may get engine/trans/diff/ wiring/instruments/wheels and suspension.
one of our club members bought a wb holden ute for $1000, that was put off the road with rust issues and out of that he got 350smlblk engine and turbo350 trans that had been recoed and a 10 bolt limited slip diff and a set of mag wheels with good tyres and driveshaft.
this was to go in a jailbar-similar to yours,so he cut the front part of the holden chassis of and grafted it on and also used the rear leaf springs and the brake booster/mastercylinder.you also get lots of little things like brakelines/fuel tank/lines/seatbelts.etc
big saving on cost and gets the bulk of the build up and running very quickly.
good luck on your build

Well, I got a bill of sale signed last night and a few more pics.
Passenger side hood hinge

driver side hood hinge

Driver side cab corner

Passenger side cab corner


Floor pans


passenger fender is pretty hit but there is another set of fenders!!!! the spare fender is in far better condition than this one.


The bed is looking pretty tattered as well. Missing passenger side fender.




Well, there she is! and there she will sit until i move out of my current home and into a new one. Might be able to get some work done on her there. But it is a TWO HOUR drive there... ugh. Working 7 days a week doesnt provide a whole lot of opportunity (or motivation on my part) to make that drive and work some more, then drive back lol. sorry, running on 4 hours of sleep right now. Oh and the engine's bell housing was cast with the block... is that a normal sight on these flattys? And there is two transmissions. Idk, anybody interested in the flathead and a trans? one trans is bolted up to the engine, other trans is seperate. Also has stock drive shaft.

Where can you find the VIN's on these? My fiance's cousin bought this at an auction years ago (no title). and some jerk off spray bombed the thing black (still blue under the dash) and there is a tag on the fire wall that was sprayed over but you cant even see any ridges on the plate either. Found another one in the glove box, also spray bombed. Might try to get some paint thinner and srtip off the paint to see if i can read it. are there any other areas to check???

Originally Posted by 41HalfTonFord

Well, I got a bill of sale signed last night and a few more pics.
Passenger side hood hinge

driver side hood hinge

Driver side cab corner

Passenger side cab corner


Floor pans


passenger fender is pretty hit but there is another set of fenders!!!! the spare fender is in far better condition than this one.


The bed is looking pretty tattered as well. Missing passenger side fender.




Well, there she is! and there she will sit until i move out of my current home and into a new one. Might be able to get some work done on her there. But it is a TWO HOUR drive there... ugh. Working 7 days a week doesnt provide a whole lot of opportunity (or motivation on my part) to make that drive and work some more, then drive back lol. sorry, running on 4 hours of sleep right now. Oh and the engine's bell housing was cast with the block... is that a normal sight on these flattys? And there is two transmissions. Idk, anybody interested in the flathead and a trans? one trans is bolted up to the engine, other trans is seperate. Also has stock drive shaft.

Where can you find the VIN's on these? My fiance's cousin bought this at an auction years ago (no title). and some jerk off spray bombed the thing black (still blue under the dash) and there is a tag on the fire wall that was sprayed over but you cant even see any ridges on the plate either. Found another one in the glove box, also spray bombed. Might try to get some paint thinner and srtip off the paint to see if i can read it. are there any other areas to check???

The VIN is located on top of the driver's side of the frame near the front. Don't be surprised if you can't find it. It may be covered with rust It is also stamped on the top center of the bell housing. It wil start and end with * (stars) It will look something like this *I8-1111111*. Supposedly it is also located near the rear of the drivers side frame rail, but I have never seen one there.

Originally Posted by LjH

The VIN is located on top of the driver's side of the frame near the front. Don't be surprised if you can't find it. It may be covered with rust It is also stamped on the top center of the bell housing. It wil start and end with * (stars) It will look something like this *I8-1111111*. Supposedly it is also located near the rear of the drivers side frame rail, but I have never seen one there.

Right on, thanks for that.

Being over an hour drive to where the truck is at right now, i am not really sure as to when i will be able to make it over there. Since there is not title, i was told that you can take the VIN to the county sherrifs office, they run the number and if everything checks out good they give you a piece of paper that you can take to the Secretary of state office to get a title for it. Does anyone have any experience in doing this?

We have some flathead guys on here that can help you ID what the engine is....

The truck will definitely need some patching and repairing but overall IMO is certainly a good builder, I've started with a lot less in a lot worse condition!!!!! Couple other guys on here doing projects the same vintage, I'm sure they'll be able to provide some good information for you, too!

Hope you get it home soon and your schedule starts allowing you more time to play with your new toy!!!!!

Thanks dave.

I will have to see if i can find the ID tag for the engine next time i am up there, it is in the bed and coverd up with the fenders and other stuff.

Yeah i cannot wait to start cutting, welding, grinding, and tinning this thing. I think i will try my hand with the lead.

on a side note, the frame (didnt get pics ) looks to be in pretty good shape. But will have to see when the bed and cab come off.

Here's some serial number info: Early Ford Serial Numbers For Cars and Trucks Manufactured for the USA Market from 1932 to 1953

The lug spread on that rear wheel doesn't look like stock 5 1/2" circle, so something is changed/modified/altered some way.

Having a portion of the bell housing cast enblock is normal for flathead V8s 48 and prior. That same site linked above has an excellent section on identifying engine vintage also.

That rust on the right cowl near the hinge is unusual, could be from sitting with piled debris (leaves or similar), but would make me wonder about what might have impacted the frame. Anyway, the normal worst spot on the frame is where the center X member intersects with the side rail (more so in the rear), forms a pocket that held debris then moisture kicked up from the wheels. Then the channel goes back within the side rail forming a doubler, again, an area to hold moisture/junk.

On the flathead, lots of people seem to think that because it's old it's automatically rare and valuable, but like Uncle Bob said there's a better than even chance that the block may be cracked. When I talked to a guy from H&H Flatheads about a '32 engine (unique, one year production, first V8 Ford) he shared that he never pays more than $200 to $300 for an old stock engine, even a '32, and even then it may be scrap metal. They're worth big bucks when confirmed good and built out with new parts, but until then they're not that valuable. Uncle Bob may chime in here and tell me how far off base I am, but that's my understanding from talking to one source last year.

[QUOTE=rspears;519941]he shared that he never pays more than $200 to $300 for an old stock engine, even a '32, and even then it may be scrap metal. QUOTE]

hey, if i got a couple hundred bucks for something i am not going to be using, that is fine with me! haha. but maybe next time i am up there i will pull the heads and see how the block looks. i know it still doesnt confirm 100% if it is a good or bad block, but maybe worth the effort.

thanks Bob for the link. I also thought that the rear end didn't look quite right, but i am still at the know nothing stage so i didnt take any other pics or even make note of it.

LOTS of research in my near future!

Roger, you're running the bases just fine.

I operate in similar fashion to the Herrmans. If I go to buy a flathead I insist on being able to inspect the top deck, in other words, the heads have to come off. Poorly informed sellers, you know, those guys who've heard that flatheads are "rare", desirable, kool, blah blah, will usually protest that it will make the engine harder to sell for good money if it's disassembled. I make an attempt to educate them to reality which ends up about 50% effective. Some don't want to be confused by fact. At that point, if it's a mostly complete engine, I offer $100 and give my card. Sometimes I hear back, sometimes not. Probably the next guy who made the same pitch got it for the same price because he was there when the seller figured out reality. My rationale is I can get my $100 back between core value on certain components and scrap.........but it's still pretty much a trading dollar deal. You usually won't feed the chickens on the difference, with an occasional exception.

If upon inspection of the usual deadly crack areas (more than just the deck) it looks reasonably good and the crank turns freely, I'll go up to $250 on an 8BA, and higher for a top line 59ab, somewhere in between on the others. It's still a gamble as internal cracks, or ones so fine that these feebler eyes don't see them, may be there. Any meaningful flathead rebuild starts with magnaflux AND pressure test, plus sonic check if going big bore. Lots of potential pit falls.

All that doom and gloom aside, there is a market out there for these, and it's still reasonably healthy, in my area at least. That being said, you still may have to be persistent in advertising. You never know when your serious buyer is looking. It may be a day, it may be a month or more from the first day you post. I've been cleaning shop the past few months and have had one engine advertised for close to 3 months now with little interest. A couple months back I had one sell the first day, to a guy who drove 150 miles one way that same day...........because he wanted it NOW! You never know.

Stand at Drivers side front Fender, look over fender into engine compartment at frame right where it connects to the main body. On top of the frame will be the vin number for the truck stamped into the frame. This is the number you want to title the truck to, any other number will just cause you trouble. There were no vin numbers on any tag on the body like later cars/trucks.
This truck is going to teach you a lot of trades including bodyman. Good Luck.
If you go Ford 302, watch for rear sump oil pan, likely out of early Bronco. You will need that. I have a 50 with a 302 and a T-5 standard trans that will meet all of your stated requirements so that will be a good setup for you.

It seems like everyone will tell you to get a rear sump oil pan... why? and holy h3ll the choices that are out there. I am thinking that i am going to end up waiting on the motor and trans until i get this body and frame straightened out. Keep them tips coming though!

anyone have thoughts on what rear axle i should run? gearing? I know it is early in the game for me, but never too early to start lookin for parts.

Originally Posted by 41HalfTonFord

It seems like everyone will tell you to get a rear sump oil pan... why? and holy h3ll the choices that are out there. I am thinking that i am going to end up waiting on the motor and trans until i get this body and frame straightened out. Keep them tips coming though!

anyone have thoughts on what rear axle i should run? gearing? I know it is early in the game for me, but never too early to start lookin for parts.

The rear axle of choice leans towards the Ford 9" which was in a wide range of vehicles through the years (link http://www.dutchmanaxles.com/images/...Ford_Truck.pdf ) but one from a Mustang is a good strong rear, too. As for the gearing, that should be the last thing you change, selected based on the final drive ratio from the tranny you select, and the rear tire diameter you choose, based on keeping the cruise rpm at the right spot in the torque curve for the engine you've chosen. Picked right you'll get the acceleration you want in the lower gears matched to the best cruise rpm/economy you can get on the highway.

Some frames have a cross member that will either hit or cause you to raise the motor because the Fords normally run the oil sump in the front, If your chassis is like mine, there isn't a problem with a crossmember in the way. I did a 47 pickup years ago and while it would clear the crossmember, the front axle would hit the sump on a big bump, but back then there wasn't any front sump and pickup from ford. You had to do your own.

This is where mock-up will be critical for you. And some of the guys here that are building the same style right now may save you some time and effort as they may have gone through the issue(s) already.

Just wondering if anyone knows how much this truck weighs? Trying to figure out if i need to borrow a heavier duty vehicle than my own to tow this gem home.