Thread: Starting it early, 41 ford PU

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This is my first build. I am 24 years old, i know i have a helluva lot of work ahead of me on this. I know this will take a "few" years to "finish" lol. But here is my story...

My fiance's cousin was selling a 1941 half ton Ford pick up (hence the user name) After his dad passed it was too big of a project to take on. As of right now the only major things that are missing would be the hood, grille, and radiator. He said it has two sets of front and rear fenders. Just at a glance i noticed floor pans are in need of being replaced. Not too sure on the cab corners yet. I will be driving up to see it again this weekend and sign a bill of sale. He also said it will be coming with a flathead v8 and trans. He isnt too sure on what the trans is, (i am assuming stock).

So my dream for this truck. I would like to make this truck into a street rod. Nothing too fancy or "pretty", but looks nice. And i want some POWER!!! but not where i am going to be running 8 second 1/4 miles. I want it to be a driver. Something that if i wanted to hook my jetski trailer to it and drive across the state, i wouldn't think twice.

First question, what are yall doin to the flat heads to pull some more power out of them? (i am sure the year of the motor will also weigh in on this)

second, What Transmission would you reccomend with the motor? (i know preference varies person to person. I would like something where i can cruise at 70mph and maybe about 2k rpm or less)

third, Assuming this is a virgin truck, i would like power steering, disc brakes and the independent suspension in the front. Any pointers on doing a front end swap? What year of what car?

fourth, Rear end... i do not want the rear axle to blow out on me, what would be a mild gearing (fun but still highway driveable) with a newer rear end, and suspension set up? I am assuming most will say fourlink, but that seems like it will be very stiff. again, i want a nice ride that i can cruise in, but still play when i pull up next to a mustang or something. I just dont want to be fighting the axle bouncing on me.

VVVV only pic ive got so far

Welcome. Not one of these old fart experts will ever admit it but they all were once in your shoes with their first build. You are way ahead of most of us in that you are asking for advice right off the bat. Most of us plugged along with a dream and only sheer determination or stupidity got our truck running. You will learn a lot and it will help you in ways you never would expect. Good Luck.
Now about your questions: Power! really 250 to 300 hp will scoot that truck right down the road with a couple of ski's behind real fine. There is lots of ways to get that power, your flathead can do it, lots of 6 cyls can do it, almost every V8 can fit the bill. Do you have an urge for a special motor or open to the easy low buck motor? Chev V8 is tried and true and low buck as you can get. Ford small block V8 is a little more work but again easy to do. Building your flathead is points to some, it will cost slightly more than a late model stock V8 to acheive the same horsepower. All this is your choice.
Front end: modified stock will work, Mustang II type is common and will act better on highway. Aftermarket kit that I think is best is Fat Man. Super quality and simple build for you.
Rear end: late model rear on leaf springs is the easiest. 9" Ford can be cruiser or take anything you can throw at it. smaller mustang rear is cheap and will last forever at those powers, S-10 Chevrolet also fits and works great.
A well built mild street rod will do all you are asking. Mine has been Coast to Coast 3 times now and while not show quality or expensive, it sure is fun. Good luck.

Welcome to CHR! Sounds like you have the start of a nice truck, and a good plan for it. Knowing what direction you want to go on the build is the first and one of the most important things to do and your's sounds quite realistic. I'd also go the Fat Man route on the front, and either a leaf spring rear or a triangulated 4-bar with coilovers---the reason some of these ride so harsh is the builder used too high a rate spring on the coilovers, and or has a set of coilovers with too little travel. I'm no big flathead fan at all, too expensive to put together. With what you want for performance a good crate motor (with warranty I might add) from your favorite manufacturer (Chevy has them starting a $1500.00) and an overdrive automatic will more then meet your criteria!

I also would congratulate you on knowing up front that this will be a time consuming project! So, you're off to a great start, now just plan your work and work your plan, ask lots of questions, and enjoy the process!!!!

Thanks guys for the input. I AM OPEN TO ALL INPUT AND FEEDBACK!!! lol. A buddy of mine has a 302 in his garage, says it hasn't ran in a year but still turns over. believe me, i want EASY, but i kinda still want to keep it a Ford truck. i am by no means a die hard Ford guy, just one of those things... If the Flat head is going to take too much of my dime and time, i will let it go. Im sure there are a few people on here would like to get their hands on it.

I was also thinking that i want the truck sitting a little bit lower than its stock height. The Fatman MII clip should drop the front end right? that is what their website says. Then maybe i could find a mustang rear end that is in good condition as well.

I would LOVE a standard transmission, but if i do use it to tow the toys, and getting stuck in rush hour.... nahh i want a standard. That is all part of the fun right? idk, we will have to see which direction i go. kind of depends on what trans i end up with.

Yes Scootin, this will be a "budget" build, lol. lookin for whatever low cost items i can to get her running. HOWEVER, i will not cheap out on the front end. Fatman looks like some good stuff, i will contact them to see what i need. Might even just run the stock rear end if it looks good enough.

I think the Fiance will soon regret givin me the full and clear green light on this project

Welcome to CHR! Sounds like a great project, and that picture looks like the truck is in pretty good shape for the start. I'm one of those Ford in Ford guys, so I vote for grabbing that 302 from your buddy, or looking at some of the 302/331/347 crate engines you can get out there. Check Ford Racing Parts for a start. The Tremec five speed, TKO500 or 600 depending on how much you push your engine build, is a great choice for what you're wanting. You can pick up a used T5 cheap, but too many of them see hard duty and are "grenades waiting to explode" IMO. The flathead is very cool, and gets you lots of points from the purists, but when you start looking at towing across the state at 70+ I'd wonder about the reliability long term. Plus you'll spend two to three times what you spend on the 302 and top out at about 225 to 250hp/200ftlbs torque if it's the big flathead. Just look at the prices of a flathead "crate" from someone like H&H for comparison - $10K and up and you've got maybe a 50/50 chance that your block will be good since they're susceptible to cracking. Fatman is good stuff!

Lots of good build advice from experienced guys on here, and you can pick up a ton of tips on "how to" by reading through some build threads, especially for working metal. Hope we see you here through the build, and that you like to take pictures as you go.

Welcome to CHR sounds like a great project. Its nice having another Michigan guy on here I think we're gaining

Originally Posted by rspears

Lots of good build advice from experienced guys on here, and you can pick up a ton of tips on "how to" by reading through some build threads, especially for working metal. Hope we see you here through the build, and that you like to take pictures as you go.

Thanks for the welcome. I have seen you all over the forums while i was creepin haha. You seem to really know your stuff. Yeah not lookin to drop that kind of coin right now for a motor/trans. I think i can get this 302 off him for cheap (chevy guy ) he wont be using it. I have already learned a lot while looking at some of these other threads. And yeah, i do like to take pics. Going to try to get some more pics tonight and check it out some more.

Originally Posted by 41HalfTonFord

Thanks for the welcome. I have seen you all over the forums while i was creepin haha. You seem to really know your stuff....

Kind words, and I probably spend way too much time typing! I'm not in any way in the group who "knows their stuff" around here. I jumped into this process late in life, and bring some book learning along from my career, but I don't have the "street/strip cred" that others bring, which means I may know just enough to get into trouble I turn a good phrase and can find lots of support info on the net, but there's others here that know the path from experience, and they're the guys you want to listen to and respect for their opinions and suggestions.

Bottom line, I'm glad you're here and look forward to watching your build!

I can't add to much to what's already been said. So welcome.

.

Welcome to the forum and I applaud your desire to build the F1 into a street rod. Unless you have tools, a place to work, fabricating skills and the ability to weld plus anywhere from 5 grand upwards to start you're biting off a big chunk. Realistically you need, IMHO, to sit down and put your thoughts on paper and start pricing the things you want to do especially those that you can't do yourself. Dropping a late model V8, transmission and rearend into an early Ford chassis is not as easy as it appears and involves quite a bit of fabrication.
There are a number of top notch builders on this forum that have the time, money and skills to build what you are attempting and that's not to say that you can't do it, just be aware of what you're getting in to.
BTW, in 1964 I drove a 36 5 window coupe with a fairly hot sbc from Ohio to California so I've been down the road a bit.
Good luck on whatever you decide to do.

Most of what's been said is reasonably accurate for where you are in the process, I'll just refine some of the info from personal experience since I just recently parted with my '41 flathead powered truck.

First, save yourself some embarrassment on (albeit minor) nomenclature. The F100 designation didn't apply to Ford pickups until it's first usage in 1953. In some arenas you'd get pummeled mercilessly for that faux pas.

As you refine your criteria it will get easier to give you more specific answers, pros/cons, vendors or options. Looks like you're starting to narrow down from your opening post which would take hours to answer all the possible permutations.

A couple months ago I had 7 flatheads in my garage, three in vehicles and 4 on the floor, so I'm into the flathead vibe. That being said, if you want 70 mph cruising, and light towing capability, I'd say the flathead isn't your most economical route. As noted above, these are not a cheap engine to make hp with. 250 hp is optimistic though achievable, and given you'd have a long stroke motor to do that torque would be good, but that $10k number (all dressed out) is realistic if not light. If you go to sell the existing engine make sure the heads are off, any serious/knowledgeable flathead buyer will want to look for cracks.........it's a 75% probability of being cracked in my experience.

If you're serious about 2k rpm at 70ish and cost is high on your list of limiting factors an auto is going to cost a lot less than a stick if you want something that will stand up to using the truck as a truck on occasion (especially the towing part).

The 302 would be a fine engine, but you'll have some extra expense with that versus the SBC. Parts are readily available to "fix" a SBF for fit, just adds to the build cost. Depending on what front suspension you settle on you'll likely have to convert to rear sump pan/pump. The leg room in these starts getting real tight if you're 6 ft. tall or more. In fact at 6 foot it's not too comfortable on longer hauls than putting around town.............although at 24 you're more flexible so could put up with more compromise. The SBF is longer than a SBC so might need to require some setback and firewall mod. Not a difficult procedure, but does eat precious interior foot room.

Most of what I do on this vintage of Ford is variations on stock design suspension, which can be made to function quite well and has a lot of flexibility for ride height. But, given what you've indicated as priorities so far, the MII front, and later rear seem more appropriate. I'm not a Fat Man fan, due more to appearance than quality, but to each his own. Depending on where you go with your choices I'll add another vendor to the mix, Chassis Engineering Inc. (that Inc. is an important appendage if you want to research the correct company) They also make a couple choices of MII front kit, and offer a very easy to install parallel rear spring setup. The one draw back of their rear suspension is they almost always require lowering blocks to get the rear end down if you're into appealing appearing ride height. Posies has a rear parallel kit that's friendlier and good quality also. I'm not a fan of coilovers if you're really planning to use it as a utility vehicle on occasion.

The missing grille isn't much of an issue, Bob Drake makes an excellent reproduction.......about $700. If you're a good shopper and patient you can occasionally find someone who is selling one they bought but never got around to installing (lots of folks bite off a project they eventually learn they can't chew) for less. Now comes the detail stuff. On a hood............you're in for an adventure unless Lady Luck is your partner. No, it's not the same as the standard model passenger car, they appear similar, but the trucks are different. And, the '41 is different from the '40. The '41 has more holes for the different trim that it uses from the '40, AND the stock hood latches are in different places so have different brackets underneath. If you end up going with a stock config latch then you'll also need the corresponding backing bracket for the grille to mount the lower latch opening. Then there's the center trim on a '41. Unlike the '40, it's not reproduced (some vendors show a new replacement in their catalog, but trust me, they haven't actually had them for a few years now). Worse, the hood ornament is two pieces, the big water fall looking piece, and a small lift handle for the hood latch release. That handle is unique to the '41 and VERY hard to find in unbroken condition. On mine I preferred the cleaner look of the '40 trim so located a '40 hood and went that way (pic below). So, you've got down the road choices there, but should keep an eye out from the get go as these parts are not easy to find (except the repro hood trim pieces from Drake for the '40). Also, almost every hood you might find will likely need repair at the back in the vicinity of the internal hinge brackets. I've never found one that wasn't cracked in a few.....and more often, many.......places.

wow, thank you Bob! Lots of information! Beautiful truck. I will keep my eyes open for those problem areas if i end up heading up to check out the truck.

Yes money is relatively high on my list of criteria, but again, i am not looking to build this in a year or even two. LOTS of time to put some cash aside to buy what i want and need. Lots of time too look for that hood and grille. So the 40 hood will fit the 41 you are saying? just different trim? I am not looking to build a concourse truck here, lol, just something fun to do with the kid and make some memories. I am young and a bit short on tools, but hey that gives the fiance (soon to be wife) the perfect opportunity for christmas

This is why i love these forums, even in a couple years when i forget a vendors name or something, i can always come back here and refresh. Thanks guys!!! I am glad to be on here and look forward to sharing this build with yall.

Welcome aboard 41 1/2ton good to see you here. Sounds like a awesome build you're undertaking. I'll be watching for a build thread so I can follow along and pester you for pictures!

Originally Posted by Bob Parmenter

First, save yourself some embarrassment on (albeit minor) nomenclature. The F100 designation didn't apply to Ford pickups until it's first usage in 1953. In some arenas you'd get pummeled mercilessly for that faux pas.

Thank you for clearing that up as well

I appreciate stuff like that to keep myself from lookin a fool.

Oh, and i am headed out to check out the truck!!! will get some more pics up tomorrow!

Welcome to CHR! Like you have just seen, there are a lot of great knowledgable guys that lke to help. I was going to mention chassis engineering Inc as well. You can buy your engine mount kits, a MII kit, and pretty much what ever else you may need for your chassis from them. They are great people and have great service.

Now, since you seem like you'd like a manual trans, try this option. Find a ZF 5 speed from a mid 80's-97 old body style ford F-150 or F-250. These trucks also have 302's and 351's so you should be able to bolt it to your 302. These have hydraulic operated clutches so fitment may be easier as well. A lot of guys seem to be running 8.8 ford rear ends too lately. Ones from Explorers are pretty popular and have disc brakes. If you have a OD top gear and run a decent height rear tire, you can probably run like a 3:50 rear gear and still keep your goal rpm cruising number. In the next week or so I'll have a parallel leaf spring kit I'll be selling out from under my 40 Ford. It should bolt right on your truck frame as they are pretty dang close to the same aside from some body mount brackets. Good luck on the search for parts, and journey! Sure looks like you are starting with a pretty good truck too!