JMHO, I would think steel or cooper/nickel line would be better. Just my 2 cents.
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JMHO, I would think steel or cooper/nickel line would be better. Just my 2 cents.
Jim, I'm OK using it, and like you say it would be tucked up high on the rail, just beneath the floor so I can't see that rocks or debris is really an issue, especially with a mechanical pump pulling suction on a siphon feed line.
Ryan, I hadn't thought about the evil ethanol being an issue. Your comment about fuel having ethanol even if it's labeled ethanol free bothers me. I try to always buy ethanol free fuel, 87 octane for my "regular" vehicles and 92 for the '33, and the thought that they're actually pushing ethanol isn't good but I'm not sure how one would know.
The issue is that I've got a 25' coil of 3/8" aluminum tube that came in my pile of parts, and whether to use it or spend more dollars on something else. If I change I'll likely go with a braided fabric neoprene type tube vs hard line. That's what came from Edelbrock on the EFI package for the '33, and it's very easy to use. I'll take a look at Speedway and Summit just for grins.
Thanks for the input!
We've got 20 or so gasoline burning pieces of equipment at work. We used to buy all our gas right from the airport. The alcohol content has been so high that anything aluminum in the system is eaten up. Or, the old style o rings and rubber lines are eaten up and we have had to replace many components due to the ethanol and alcohol. We have been buying our gas from quick fuel for the last year and that was the only way we could get a no ethanol gas and be certain. When we met with the quick fuel reps, I couldn't believe the stuff they told us all the gas stations were doing. It's just as bad, actually worse on the biodiesel.
Is "quick fuel" QuikTrip? Our QT has dedicated pumps (red handles) for no ethanol regular grade, and our newest Casey's store has dedicated pumps for no ethanol 92 octane.Quote:
Originally Posted by 40FordDeluxe
I've tried to buy only ethanol free for the past year or more for everything - better efficiency, no loss in octane due to phase separation, no corrosive alcohol in the bottom of the tank. My truck and Jeep probably go well over a month between fills these days. It's probably been 6 months or more on the '33!!
I'm not saying there's a lot of alcohol in our gas in California, but I heard on the news the other day that a fellow locked himself in his garage with his car running and only got drunk............
Roger, no quick fuel is a fleet fueling company. They get their fuel/gas right out of the filling setups off the line.
36Sedan, :LOL: It possibly could happen these days!
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When I did the coupe I used 3/8" Aluminum line, never had any issue.
Here in MA. all we can get is gas with 10% ethanol. Still never a problem. The coupe has been sitting since last summer - not even started but once in December I think. I've no doubt it will fire off and run with no issues.
In fact, maybe that's what I'll do this afternoon. I've taken a couple days away from work and stayed home to play with the puppy while the wife runs north to see her sisters.
I don't mind aluminum line on a drag car, but I used it once on a street car and withing 3 weeks had a rock punch a hole in it. Steel line for me on the street!
I've been doing some looking, and found a couple of auto magazine tech articles on upgrading fuel lines due to ethanol blends, E85 and pure ethanol fuels eroding lines, and losing fuel due to vapors permeating rubber and neoprene lined hoses, like braided SS. The 3/8" aluminum line that I have is only ~0.025" thick and soft. I think it would be OK, and my first thought was to just use it and let the next guy replace it when the time comes, but that's not the way I like to do things. Steel would be better, but over time it's subject to internal corrosion too. It looks to me like the way to go is a PTFE style hose, like Earl's Vapor Guard. It's a multi-layer hose that blocks vapors and is impervious to ethanol's corrosive tendencies. Headed out to the barn to measure. Looks like the BBT will be back again, maybe tomorrow!
Thanks for the comments!
I re-plumbed everything with PTFE hose when I converted the coupe to fuel injection a few years ago.
I'm really struggling here! I picked out the PTFE hose, fittings and clamps to the tune of $83 plus shipping, which is too close to a $100 bill and as I look at the chassis I quite honestly cannot see any way that a tire could ever throw anything up against the top of the frame rail. It would take a multiple bank shot to get there! Then there's Mike saying he's been running his aluminum line for several years, and Jim saying that he doesn't see a problem.... I totally understand the issue of ethanol erosion, but I run ethanol free fuel (assuming it's truly ethanol free), so that's a non-issue. Bottom line, it's one piece of tube 10' long with PTFE hose connecting tank to hard line, and hard line to pump. If it needs to be changed later it's a drop dead simple swap - use the same threaded holes, change out to larger clamps and swap in PTFE.
I'm using what I've got for now, and can change it later if needed. I'll keep my $100 for something else.
Now to make a one time use tube straightening jig! Again, thanks for the input!
I've heard using a length of pvc pipe works to straighten the tubing and it's cheap/I mean inexpensive.
First, thanks 36 Sedan for the PVC tip! I had a foot long piece of 1/2" SCH 40 PVC and tried that, pushing the aluminum into the PVC then once through using a push/pull and it works pretty slick! It's not perfectly straight yet, but probably good enough for what I'll need. I was going to cut 5 wheels out of wood.... You saved me a bunch of time!
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I had been going through my stash of miscellaneous "stuff" that the PO had picked up at various car show vendor booths (like 5 different types of tubing clips for 3/8" tube plus a bag of "quick mount" plastic clips for 1/8", 3/16", 1/4" and 3/8" tube), and one thing that I'd scratched my head over was this High Zoot Moroso Balancer Bolt. Why does a guy, who's picked up a complete Chevy ZZ4 engine from the local dealer, come home with a High Zoot Moroso balancer bolt? I've got to admit I wondered about it 4 years ago, and it still made me pause - Why?
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The crank pulley has been mounted forever, I believe by the PO but for some reason this morning I grabbed a flashlight and looked in the bore..... NO Balancer Bolt!
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That got me started on a look & learn since the bolt is 2.25" long and the bore in the crank is only something like 1.25" deep. Also, the super heavy duty washer from Moroso is about 3/16" thick, and too large to fit in the balancer bore by a large overlap. I had not remembered that the crank pulley goes on before the balancer bolt, but a YouTube video on how to install SBC balancers the right way gave me the answer when the guy got the balancer seated using the threaded tool he said, "Now the crank pulley has to be installed before we install the balancer bolt....." So the pulley went back on with a dab of LocTite, followed by the Balancer bolt torqued to 60 ft-lbs. Gotta love the well done, technically correct YouTube Vid's out there! Just gotta be smart enough to ignore the trash.
Now I don't know if the PO removed the stock crank pulley to put on the fancy chrome one he'd bought, and just didn't replace the balancer bolt, or if he didn't have a torque wrench but it's scary to think of lighting off the engine and having the balancer bounce across the shop floor.... Divine Guidance! Thank you, Lord!
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So the rest of the day was taking things apart. I did another tweak on the exhaust, passenger side near the tranny with a pair of wedge cuts to increase pipe to tranny clearances and added a little gusseted tab off of one rear hanger mounting tab for the gas tank rollover vent. It's not much higher than the tank vent, but on a roadster there's not much higher ground so it'll do.
Got the LOKAR shifter pulled, the headers off, and the steering shaft pulled. This thing is starting to look bare again!
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Our heat index is just nasty these days! Humidity is 41% with a measured temp of 99F which is a heat index of 111F or so! And no, it's NOT a dry heat! For an old guy it means booking it towards the house around 4pm or so, and thinking about what's next.
I'm about ready to pull the engine & tranny, split them apart and get the engine on a stand. I've got an old engine stand that the PO gave me with the engine, and I think I'll get another one from Harbor Freight to use for a chassis rotisserie - just need to level out the support tubes so it doesn't go wonky when it spins like the '33 did... :p
That's about it from here. Thanks for putting up with my ramblings.
Glad it worked for you!Quote:
Originally Posted by rspears
Out in the barn I found the pieces of my engine stand, put it together and found that as I remembered the top tube is slanted up maybe 5 degrees, but the old orange stand actually slanted down just a hair, and the two were at different levels. Thought about going to Harbor Freight to get one, thinking two for the frame rotisserie, one to hold the engine then got caught up in how to level out the top tube and not really wanting to cut them up and weld. Lifting the back end of the newer stand to level was very close to a 2x4 under the wheels, and on the other one a piece of 1/2" ply under the front wheels brought it up to dead level.
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The big payoff was that with the blocks they are very near the same level now! I'll make blocks that are tied together with a lip so they don't fall off, but it should work!
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I remembered that the engine came to me on a nifty bolt on stand on a roller base from GM, and the tranny had been on a roller base too, so I'm good for now.
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Talking to Jim Robinson, I decided to bolt on a mechanical fan to see how it fits, and I think I'm going to go with it instead of the electric which was going to be a very tight fit to the water pump pulley. I like the idea of a belt driven fan for reliability, even with no clutch.
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Attachment 72731
I ran a small 4 blade fan om my 36, but the only traffic I ever got caught in was at the entrance to Lions drag strip.:D
End of the day the IFS is off. I'm seriously considering having the frame media blasted to get rid of whatever the PO put on it before, and I really don't look forward to sanding off everything by hand....
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It's amazing how fast things can come apart. Get the frame washed up and it might not look so overwhelming for sanding. I think hitting it with a D/A wouldn't take too long unless you want all of it off, then yes defiantly media blast.
I made up a pair of mounting brackets, got them Hooked to the rotating piece from the engine stands and then used the hoist to lift up the frame and slide them into the stands.
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I used some low profile forged C-channel that I had left over from my deck railing project several years ago, and it worked slick. It's rigid and plenty strong for the frame. I paid attention to adjusting the brackets on the rotating section to keep the C-channel aligned with the center of rotation, which I really didn't do with the '33. The old stand has an angled upright, so the narrower front of the chassis goes on it.
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The back is on the newer AC Delco stand, which is upright.
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I'm very happy with the mount. It's easy to move, doesn't go over center and try to flip, and isn't at all wonky as it rotates. Keeping centers of rotation aligned is the key!
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Once mounted and checked I used the flexibility to weld out the boxing plate extensions up front, and grind them smooth. A touch of body filler before prime and they'll be good to go!
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I've been waiting for 2 days for a quote from the media blasting place, and now that I've got the frame mounted I think I'll just attack it with a DA sander and be done. Jim Robinson pointed me towards one at Harbor freight that he uses, so I'll make a run to visit HF and get this thing ready to paint.
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Nice work Roger! I requested some quotes to get my frame media blasted last week too. The cheapest quote was $450 and the guy is 6 weeks out. I'll just wire wheel it and flap disc it. Hopefully I'm done before his 6 weeks is up. :LOL: The front boxing plates turned out nice!
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I'm with Ryan. The "rotisserie" seems to work very well and the boxing plates looks slick.
Sand it and Paint it, let the assembly begin! WooHoo... LOL
Yeah, just after I posted I got the "quote" from the media blaster saying that there's no way for them to know what it will take to clean my frame but they think it will be between $250 and $500, but might be 1/2 that based on actual time required. Excuse me, but why ask for pictures and offer an "estimate"?
I'll sand it myself!
Years ago (many actually) a friend of my father told me the secret to successful estimating, "give em the the price, if the smile say "plus material".
I think your guy knew my Dads friend...
When I built my Track-T I used round tubing for the frame. It was actually black iron well pipe which has a sort of varnish coating on the outside. It sands off fairly easy on small pieces,.. but a whole frame with lots of welded intersections, etc.?? I bought a $15 sand blaster (basically a gun, a hose, and a siphon tube) and a $10 hood, got 300 pounds of "play sand" at Lowes, built a dam out of plywood to catch the sand, and I blasted the entire frame myself. :D
It took me all day, one day. When I would run out of sand in my big plastic bucket, I would shovel it up, sift it through a large sieve (from the cooking area at Walmart), and use it again. I wore out 4 tips in the sandblaster gun; I had to make a couple of them by drilling a 9/64 hole through short pieces of 1/2 inch round stock, so that slowed me down just a bit. All together it cost me $15 for the sandblaster and $10 for the hood(both which I still have), about $4 for the sieve (also still have), and $20 for the sand. The plywood and the bucket were just stuff I had lying around. It was messy and tedious, but the good news was it was cheap and, best of all, I didn't have to wait on anybody.:D:cool:
I have a siphon blaster and a pressure pot, I've blasted a lot of stuff but it isn't very fun. On a side note I have a mid grade harbor freight D/A sander and I'm happy with it.
I have a couple of blaster pots but they sure make a mess. I used to sand blast every day with one when I worked at the body shop. Character building is what the boss always said. :LOL:
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I've been looking at HF & Northern Tool and was about to pull the trigger on one of the pressure pot units at HF and happened to think that a neighbor friend does some metal projects, so I messaged him to see if maybe.... He responded that he's got one that hasn't been used for years, and I can use it any time!
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We're in the middle of a nasty line of thunderstorms this afternoon, torrential rains and no need to get soaked so I'll get it tomorrow, and then pick up some abrasive & a couple more tarps to catch as much as I can.
I had one like that I bought brand new at the Daytona Turkey Run when I was building my Model-A coupe. I got it to use on the rear end housing, front axle, etc. I could blast a spot about 3 x 4 inches and it would clog. I would have to shut it down, take off the air hose to relieve the pressure, then disassemble the sand hose and valve on the bottom, clear the clog, clear out the sand hose and reassemble everything. Start up again, blast another spot, and it would clog again so I got the pleasure of doing the whole process over again, and again, and again. I was sifting the sand when I put it in, but it didn't help. I tried two other nozzles; that didn't help either. It did that to me abut 12 or 15 times. Blasting the rear end housing should have been a 45 minute job, but it took about 4 hours. When I was finally finished, I carried the blaster out to the street for the next day's trash pickup.
When I needed to blast my roadster frame I remembered all the difficulties the old blaster gave me, so I went and got the $15 cheapie. We had one like it when I worked in a local body shop and it never gave us problems, so I found one like it. Good luck with that one, Roger. If it works that's great, if not take a look at this... https://www.amazon.com/Jewboer-Blast...%2C183&sr=8-29
LOL I'll only pick up one bag of abrasive, Jim, to see how it works! Thanks for the tips.
Jim, my sand blaster is exactly the same as yours.
Every now and then the local quarry gets an excess of fines which they sell off as fill for $3 a cubic metre, so I go get myself a trailer load, transfer some of it to fish bins which I then store in my shed. (The rest gets dumped, usually as fill.)
Whenever I think of it I tip the sand from one fish bin into another, so that over a period of months it dries completely.
Then when it's totally dry I too use a cheap sieve to remove the larger pieces.
And when I need to blast something I've got any amount of dry clean sand to do it.
(I'm most probably preaching to the converted, but don't use river sand for blasting. River sand is rounded whereas quarry sand is crushed and is therefore multifaceted which is far more abrasive, whereas the rounded river sand can heat and distort light steel panels.)
I use the white silica sand. It is often sold as "play sand" for kids' sandboxes. it's coarse and the grains have sharp edges. I've been told it's actually crushed granite..?
I have a plastic garbage can with a lid that I keep my sand in and the can is in my storage shed so it doesn't see any rain. It stays really dry in there. If the sand somehow gets damp while I'm using it, I just throw it back in there and leave the lid off for a few days and it dries out.
Blasting sheet metal is always a risky proposition. Any media that generates heat can distort sheet metal.
OK, you guys have convinced me that simpler is better! How can I argue with two success stories, especially when one's from the US and the other from NZ! I'm still not sure about the play sand, but outside with a respirator mask may be OK. I may spring for some plastic beads, or aluminum oxide.
I've ordered the Jewboer siphon blaster and will leave my friend's old pressure unit with him for now! Heck, he might've picked it up from the curb in Florida for all I know! He did say he's had it forever, so I expect it's several iterations back on the "new & improved" changes ;):LOL:.
i use starblast or acrylic . no silica in my shop. remember heat is not what causes the warping . it is the peening of the surface . peening stretches the surface causing it to warp. stay at a 45 degree angle so no peening occurs .
I have blasted lots of stuff with that same unit, it works well. I like the black diamond fine grit from Tractor supply. You have to have clean dry consistent grit or your going to clog right up. I got a sand sifter from a prospecting supply to clean and reuse the sand, it works great and I've cleaned it several times ( I have a huge tarp from harbor freight ). Silica sand is very hazardous to your lungs I don't use it anymore. Even with the black diamond I use a supplied air set up.
v8nutz I'm aware of the silicosis danger and it's serious, no cure. I checked a YouTube video on cleaning media, and they used a 16gage screen. Is that about right for the Tractor Supply black diamond abrasive?Quote:
Originally Posted by v8nutz
I'm heading to HF today, and tarps are on my list! I'd looked at Tractor Supply for abrasive, too.
the trick to pressure blasters is the pressure must be the same in the tank and the hose . my big one is sensitive. too much in the hose and the media wont enter the stream , too much in the tank and it will fill the hose .
I visited Harbor Freight today and picked up a little 6" palm grip pneumatic random orbit sander (one recommended by Jim Robinson) and a bunch of stick on abrasives that were cheap in bulk. I figure since it's raining too much to move things outside, and since I can flip the frame any way I need to for access I'll attack the flat surfaces with the sander, and if it does OK then the round tube is a lot less intimidating. I may blast it, or I may just go after it with the sander too! I've got time, regardless since I'm working for myself.
Shine, that's an interesting observation on the pressure blaster. So once you trigger the flow you get a pressure drop from tank to hose, so you may need to adjust the tank pressure a bit but then as you work the tank pressure drops some..... Sounds like an ongoing balancing act, and having a big enough compressor feeding the tank is mandatory! Thanks for the insight!
Last time I worked for myself, my boss was a real A$$. Worked me like a dog, even followed me home (I think he was sleeping with my wife too).Quote:
Originally Posted by rspears
:eek::eek::LOL::LOL::rolleyes::p:3dSMILE::D:D:HMMM: Been a long time since I've heard that one. Thanks for bringing that laugh back. :3dSMILE:Quote:
Originally Posted by 36 sedan
Just something to watch for but here in our area if you ask for play sand you get a mixture of sands and rocks. No Bueno for media blasting. :LOL: I like the black media from TSC. They were all oos here and had no idea when more would be in. Thanks covid.
