Thread: Short Oil Filter Application

Tweet

In a Sunbeam Tiger Owner's discussion there was talk about using a shorty filter instead of the hassles of a remote mounted filter, but they stated,

To use the short filters you will need to use a shorter 1 3/16" nipple (the threaded piece that screws into the block). Ford used to carry these. The part number was D7AZ-6890-B which superceeded to F1AZ-6890-B. I don't know if they still sell them.

I have never heard about this short nipple or the need for it if running the short filters, like the WIX 51335, and NAPA Gold 1335. I'm running the short filter to clear my steering box, but did nothing to the mounting nipple that was in the block. Does anyone know why this would be necessary?

Originally Posted by rspears

In a Sunbeam Tiger Owner's discussion there was talk about using a shorty filter instead of the hassles of a remote mounted filter, but they stated,

I have never heard about this short nipple or the need for it if running the short filters, like the WIX 51335, and NAPA Gold 1335. I'm running the short filter to clear my steering box, but did nothing to the mounting nipple that was in the block. Does anyone know why this would be necessary?

Why would you need this? Sounds like someone might be using that super short (Volvo maybe??) filter - I'm just using the tried and proven Motorcraft FL300 with a 'standard' nipple:



EDIT - just looked - that WIX 51335 is the super shorty

Just a guess, but I suspect that the shorter nipple is required for clearance to actually get the filter in and out.

I ran into this on my Cadillac swap a while back. Once the filter is in there is adequate clearance, however to install and remove the filter I had to shorten the nipple just a bit (to clear the sway bar in my case).

i have one short nipple one night to many beers and a encounter with a belt sander

Originally Posted by pat mccarthy

i have one short nipple one night to many beers and a encounter with a belt sander

Has that affected your love life much??????


I used to run the short Volvo filters on my 27 with no special adapter, it just screws onto the regular Ford adapter. I suspect it is because of what Mike said about being easier to turn on a sharp angle when installing and removing the filter, if the threaded part was shorter.

Don

Originally Posted by Itoldyouso

Has that affected your love life much??????

I used to run the short Volvo filters on my 27 with no special adapter, it just screws onto the regular Ford adapter. I suspect it is because of what Mike said about being easier to turn on a sharp angle when installing and removing the filter, if the threaded part was shorter.
Don

Originally Posted by Mike P

Just a guess, but I suspect that the shorter nipple is required for clearance to actually get the filter in and out.

I ran into this on my Cadillac swap a while back. Once the filter is in there is adequate clearance, however to install and remove the filter I had to shorten the nipple just a bit (to clear the sway bar in my case).

Originally Posted by IC2

Why would you need this? Sounds like someone might be using that super short (Volvo maybe??) filter - I'm just using the tried and proven Motorcraft FL300 with a 'standard' nipple:



EDIT - just looked - that WIX 51335 is the super shorty

Dave, with this "super shorty" filter, which is a Lotus OEM as I understand, I have just enough room to the Vega steering box to change the filter without jacking up the engine. A normal "short" filter will not even come close to fitting - it's either the super shorty or a remote filter.
Mike/Don, I had not thought about clearance to get the filter out, and that makes good sense. As I said, the comment came from a Sunbeam Tiger discussion, and who knows what the interference issues are with the SBF in that confined space. I've been scratching my head why the nipple length would really matter, and I think you guys have hit the nail on the head! And once again, Pat has made me cringe just a bit just thinking about contacting a belt sander with sensitive parts....

I'm sure Mike is right on about the nipple for clearence. We did a 5.0 G.T. motor into a 67 sunbeam a few years back and no matter what we tried a remote filter was the only way and we had a hell of a time getting nuff clearence on the adapter and hoses because of the headers.Also had a hell of a time finding nuff room under the bonnet to mount the filter.Butttttt that baby sure would scoot.I sure wouldn't wanted to drive it on a rainy day.

Well, today has been a learning experience. I could not get any definitive answer on the short nipple need, but it can only be a clearance issue. What I did get was an education on that super shorty filter, and why it is considered to be undesirable, especially on a healthy stroker motor. The Sunbeam Tiger crowd has some very knowledgable guys, and I communicated with three of them today, the last being an aeronautical engineer who restores Tigers. Bottom line, that little filter creates a situation where anytime the engine calls for more oil capacity it is simply not there, so the filter gets bypassed and I'm circulating unfiltered oil. The answer is a remote filter unit using a full size filter. Product Engineering makes a really nice engine adapter unit, and I'm looking for a comparable billet aluminum remote mount for a filter. Summit has a bunch, but most are cast aluminum which is not so desirable. Once I've selected components I'll be looking for the right mounting location....

Originally Posted by rspears

Bottom line, that little filter creates a situation where anytime the engine calls for more oil capacity it is simply not there, so the filter gets bypassed and I'm circulating unfiltered oil. The answer is a remote filter unit using a full size filter. Product Engineering makes a really nice engine adapter unit, and I'm looking for a comparable billet aluminum remote mount for a filter. Summit has a bunch, but most are cast aluminum which is not so desirable. Once I've selected components I'll be looking for the right mounting location....

OK, I'll bite..

1. Are you really turning high rpm's or more just about town driving?
2. What about that adapter that turns the filter mount 90's and use a full size filter?

Not questioning your motives, just curious.

I don't know if that guys theory holds any water (or oil ) in the real world, Roger. How much extra capacity can there be in that extra couple of inches? You figure, when you prefill a filter when changing it the thing only holds such a small amount and most of that is absorbed into the filter media. If there is an extra 4 oz in a longer one vs a short one, I would think that would not be enough storage capacity to even contribute anything.

When I swapped the 5.0 Ford into my old Jeep pickup I had to use that Volvo filter as the steering box was right there. I abused that thing regularly and towed trailers long distances at times with no oiling problems ever.

Don

I can hear the orange engine guys thinking now: Besides having to reverse the pan sump, and find hardware to shorten the water pump, you guys have to fiddle with oil filters too? Hmmmmmmmmm

Uncle Bob - we Blue Oval guys are up to the challenge. Those Bow Tie guys have it too easy and no challenge but the same cookbook the next guy has.

Mike - those Ford 90 degree adapters can work fine, but you might end up with still an awkward placing. I tried on instead of the 1" shorter FL300 and it didn't work/look right

Roger - the Hamburger filter mounts aren't cast but billet. That other company has a nice block adapter but no filter mount - surprising. If I have to 'advertise' a brand name, I want both the same

Originally Posted by IC2

Uncle Bob - we Blue Oval guys are up to the challenge. Those Bow Tie guys have it too easy and no challenge but the same cookbook the next guy has.

Mike - those Ford 90 degree adapters can work fine, but you might end up with still an awkward placing. I tried on instead of the 1" shorter FL300 and it didn't work/look right

I'll have to agree with ITYS, seems much ado about nothing, IMHO!
Even my 4x4 dodge pickup used a shorty filter and still went better than 200K miles and it was ABUSED by me and my friends.

Dave, sometimes form following function is my driver! Looks are in the eyes of the beholder, right?!?!

Originally Posted by 34_40

OK, I'll bite..

1. Are you really turning high rpm's or more just about town driving?
2. What about that adapter that turns the filter mount 90's and use a full size filter?

Not questioning your motives, just curious.

Mike,
While most of my driving is easy cruising I live out in the country and it is still a big rush to hit the skinny pedal and let it pull through the gears. I'll probably grow out of it some day, but not too soon
Like Dave says, the 90degree adapter might clear, but it puts a full size filter right into the motor mount. Some of the vans had a 90 degree skinny filter unit, but I don't like that approach much.

Originally Posted by Itoldyouso

I don't know if that guys theory holds any water (or oil ) in the real world, Roger. How much extra capacity can there be in that extra couple of inches? You figure, when you prefill a filter when changing it the thing only holds such a small amount and most of that is absorbed into the filter media. If there is an extra 4 oz in a longer one vs a short one, I would think that would not be enough storage capacity to even contribute anything.

When I swapped the 5.0 Ford into my old Jeep pickup I had to use that Volvo filter as the steering box was right there. I abused that thing regularly and towed trailers long distances at times with no oiling problems ever.

Don

Don,
I think the issue is that the larger filter has about four times the filter surface area of the super shorty, so if you push it to high rpm the oil volume increases and all of that oil is forced through the filter media. With the full size it handles the duty, but with only 1/4 (or less) the surface the super shorty creates high differential, and the pump bypasses the filter.

Another thing that is a bit bothersome is that one guy shared that because of the severe piston to rod angles created by the extended stroke of the 347 they tend to be relatively short life engines compared to the stock 302 or even the 331. His thought was "Why take the chance of any oiling problems when you're already trying to cheat the clock on internal wear?" I haven't sorted that one out yet, but I have a hard time arguing with the filter differential/bypass situation.

Just so we're all thinking of the same things, this "super short" filter is pretty small. Here's pictures of the three different WIX filters, all which fit the standard Ford 3/4x16 filter nipple.
Here's the full sizeWIX 51515.png
And the mid-size/shortyWIX 51085.png
And the super shortyWIX 51335.png The super shorty measures just 2" on the straight side.

Originally Posted by Bob Parmenter

I can hear the orange engine guys thinking now: Besides having to reverse the pan sump, and find hardware to shorten the water pump, you guys have to fiddle with oil filters too? Hmmmmmmmmm

You forgot one, Bob. Our Ford parts cost about 3 times as much as similar Bowtie parts.

Don