Thread: Starter Dragging. Still!

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If the bushings are bad it could be dragging the armature on the fields. Use you volt meter at the battery and see how far down it goes when you crank and how it rocovers. It shouldn't go below 11, I think, and should come back pretty close to the same battery voltage. A voltage drop test is done by setting the meter to volts dc, hold one end right on the neg battery post, not the cable end, and the other on the starter housing. Have someone crank it and note the reading. It needs to be less than 1 volt. Do the same with the pos, holdig it to the posts, not on the cable. Also anyplace that has high resistance will be warm to the touch, might even burn you.
And FWIW, starters don't have bendix anymore unless you have something pretty old. It's called a starter drive and it will just kick the starter out when it gets bad.

I will update you guys on this. I have tried 3 different brands of starters. Still does the same thing.....

Here is what I noticed. If I turn the key to Start and hold like normal time on my Nova and newer car,. it still drags a little after the key is released.
HOWEVER, If I turn the key to Start and let it start and then release the key "quickly" it does not drag.

Originally Posted by willowbilly3

A voltage drop test is done by setting the meter to volts dc, hold one end right on the neg battery post, not the cable end, and the other on the starter housing. Have someone crank it and note the reading. It needs to be less than 1 volt. Do the same with the pos, holdig it to the posts, not on the cable. Also anyplace that has high resistance will be warm to the touch, might even burn you.

I am going to try this. To make sure I understand. When I do the Positive side test (noted at the end above) I put the red wire from volt meter to the + battery post and the - wire from volt meter anywhere on the starter housing. Right?

Both the above tests should read no more than 1 volt?

Are you using the same solenoid that was on the original starter?

Originally Posted by DennyW

Hey...hand me those Channel Locks....
Bendix, over running, self engaging, starter drive.
A self-engaging Starter drive gear, the gear moves into engagement when the Starter starts spinning and automatically disengages when the starter stops.

There are many drives out now. But, yes, there is a Bendix drive still yet.

Forgive me for my slip in liguistics, bendix is a term that was most commonly applied to the earlier bendix drive with a spring, like the Y block Fords use and I am unaware of any new automobile having used one in the last few decades, but that doesn't mean much. The spiral cut shaft type was technically a Bendix Folo-Thru drive and became more commonly referred to as just a starter drive in any local which I have had the privilage of spinning wrenches. A few old, old farmers still call them bendix.

But that doesn't help anything here
You have to do the voltage drop test while cranking, or starter engaged. And when you test the positive side you have to be on the posative terminal and the posative post on the starter, did I not word this correctly before? It is harder to explain than it is to do.

This is all good stuff guys, but it doesn't help to solve the problem.
Since he has tried at least three different starters, IMHO, that eliminates the starter as the problem. IMO that leaves four areas of concern.
1. A weak battery or a weak cell in the battery which can be verified by a load test on the battery.
2. Too small gauge positive battery cable. IMHO anything under 6 gauge is too small especially if we're talking a run of much more than two feet since as the length of the cable increases so does its impedance which will cause an undesired voltage drop.
3. An ignition switch that is close to being worn out.
4. The starter solenoid. If the contacts are burned it will cause it to stick and will also produce an undesirable voltage drop.
Personally, I would start at the starter solenoid.

Originally Posted by DennyW

Your absolutely correct nfday. I retract all I said. Except the farmer part...

Thanks, Denny. I'm just an old shade tree mechanic and if I have any expertise at all it's in the electrical end. At one time or another I have encountered all four of the situations I posted.

Nothing to add, just a good post I want to follow!

On a different starter note had a friend with a high compression 327 in a 67 vette, who couldn't get it to turn over when the car was warm. The exhaust would heat up the starter and the resistence of electricity I guess would increase. He solved it by getting a high compression low profile starter. Now it works like a champ. Didn't drive his car for a year because of this problem!

Originally Posted by stovens

Nothing to add, just a good post I want to follow!

On a different starter note had a friend with a high compression 327 in a 67 vette, who couldn't get it to turn over when the car was warm. The exhaust would heat up the starter and the resistence of electricity I guess would increase. He solved it by getting a high compression low profile starter. Now it works like a champ. Didn't drive his car for a year because of this problem!

That's a fairly expensive fix. IMHO it would have been cheaper to install a heat wrap around the starer and/or replacing the positive battery cable with one of a larger gauge and better insulation.

Originally Posted by NTFDAY

That's a fairly expensive fix. IMHO it would have been cheaper to install a heat wrap around the starer and/or replacing the positive battery cable with one of a larger gauge and better insulation.

Actually it was about $145.00 for a 25k car. I helped with the install, so that was free. Not too bad in my book for peace of mind.

Originally Posted by DennyW

Your absolutely correct nfday. I retract all I said. Except the farmer part...

No disrespect to farmers intended and I was just talking about where I live. I grew up on a farm/ranch myself.
NFTDAY, sorry for correcting you on the word usage, didn't mean it the way it sounded and it had nothing to do with the problem.

Denny, I know being right and not being challenged or corrected on any level is very important to you so I offer no further comments on my sources for the nomenclature.
I have offered all I can with the advice to do the routine testing so I bow out of this conversation.

Originally Posted by NTFDAY

Since he has tried at least three different starters, IMHO, that eliminates the starter as the problem. IMO that leaves four areas of concern.
1. A weak battery or a weak cell in the battery which can be verified by a load test on the battery.
2. Too small gauge positive battery cable. IMHO anything under 6 gauge is too small especially if we're talking a run of much more than two feet since as the length of the cable increases so does its impedance which will cause an undesired voltage drop.
3. An ignition switch that is close to being worn out.
4. The starter solenoid. If the contacts are burned it will cause it to stick and will also produce an undesirable voltage drop.
Personally, I would start at the starter solenoid.

1. I have had the battery tested and a load test done on the battery while in the car. All check out OK last summer.

2. I have what I say is a NORMAL sized + battery cable from the battery in the trunk, down along the frame and to the starter. This is in a 32 ford? Think I should go larger since I am running the length of the car?

3. Ignition switch- I will have to check into this. It is a tilt column/switch out of a GM Van.

4. I don't think it would be the starter solenoid since I have tried 3 starters and they made no difference......I could not be so lucky!