Paint stick and a penny is the gap I've always used, kind of an old saying around here. When doing body work, always seem to have a paint stick around, and on the good days even a penny in the pocket!!!!:LOL::LOL::LOL:
Printable View
Paint stick and a penny is the gap I've always used, kind of an old saying around here. When doing body work, always seem to have a paint stick around, and on the good days even a penny in the pocket!!!!:LOL::LOL::LOL:
That's a thick paint stick!!!! I like to stay somewhere's between 1/8" - 3/16" on driver's, tight side of 1/8" on trailered cars
Continuing on to the driver's side, this one is a bit tighter at the bottom than the other, shows about 1/32 gap. Used the compass again to mark the cut line...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture202.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture204.jpg
Tacked, welded, and welds dressed...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture207.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture208.jpg
All finished for this evening, have a couple pin holes to fix, will get them when we do the top...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture209.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture210.jpg
Measured the gap on both sides, it is right at 5/32", or to be more technical, one paint stick width....
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture213.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture211.jpg
Wow, great work! Thanks for posting this. I never gave a thought to using a compass for this. That's a great idea!
Ok, one side left to go...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture214.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture215.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture216.jpg
Trimming to fit..........
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture217.jpg
Welding the layers together....
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture219.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture220.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture221.jpg
After dressing the welds..... I do have a couple pin holes to fix, but the gap is looking much better.
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture224.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture226.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture227.jpg
Wow, very nice work! That looks amazing. Clear and move on. :LOL:
Robert great coverage and pics of the repairs . This does give a great insight to doing some tedious work for alignment on the panel . I did it to the mustang doors and fenders .
Thanks for the comments fellas. Spent tonight working on the tailgate jamb area, touching up some factory welds in preparation of installing the rear tail pan. Wasn't too long before Murphy's law reared its ugly head, and the lower part of the jamb showed some signs of rust lurking inside.
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture229.jpg
Cut open an access hole and cleaned out the inside as best I could for welding in some new metal..
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture230.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture231.jpg
For making a replacement, I have an "anvil" I made recently out of some scraps from under the welding table...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture232.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture233.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture234.jpg
Here's the anvil end we'll use this evening as matched up to the original...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture236.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture237.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture240.jpg
Fitting, trimming, and welding...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture242.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture243.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture246.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture247.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture248.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture249.jpg
....and, as can be expected, one more to go... Until next time.
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture250.jpg
Robert, excellent anvil! That is an awesome idea. I have been thinking of making a die so to speak to put in my press. I'm going to remove the bumpers on my 40 and I thought I'd be proactive and make some rectangle pieces and put a curve in the center to agg rigidity and help it contour the fender/tail pan. This way if later on I decide I want bumpers again, I can just unbolt the covers and bolt the bumpers back on. Anyhow, keep up the great work. It's nice to be able to watch a pro and pick up what ever a guy can. :LOL:
Ryan, some of those home-made tools are the most used..
Had a couple hours this evening so I decided to remove some mud daubers nest....
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture251.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture252.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture254.jpg
Used a combination of burr grinder, roloc sander, etc, to clean out the rust and scale as best I could. Once the car is up on the rotisserie again, the troublesome voids such as these will get a good flood of paint.
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture256.jpg
As this one needs a bit more flange turned in, the inside will need a bit more stretch to go with it. A suitable hammer with more heft will come in handy.
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture258.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture259.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture260.jpg
A couple fitments and adjustments, and this is ready for the welder...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture261.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture262.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture263.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture264.jpg
and with it getting late, we'll cover the welding on the next update..
time and patients great work
Great work! You sure make it look easy! :LOL:
You should see the scrap pile! :LOL:
Time to finish this part up....
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture263.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture266.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture267.jpg
All cleaned up....
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture275.jpg
Starting on the tailpan, we were torn on using the pinch weld flanges. Some of the "subtle" mods we had done included removing the pinch weld flanges and leaded seam above and below the tail lights to get rid of a dirt trap/rust generator...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture276.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture277.jpg
The pinch weld seam for the tail pan is also in the tires path, especially given the wider rear tires and mini-tubs it's now using.
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture278.jpg
So we decided to get rid of these as well, and butt weld the panel in. With the car still sitting on the frame, the standard offset snips had some interference issue with the frame rails...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture281.jpg
Luckily my lovely bride had picked these up for me a couple years ago...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture282.jpg
For a much better fit in such a tight area...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture283.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture284.jpg
The tailpan was trimmed as well, leaving a bit extra to insure we had enough metal to span the gap...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture288.jpg
Used the tipping tool to unfold the remainder of the flange and the door skin hammer to flatten it out...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture289.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture290.jpg
After another test fit, the reproduction showed to be not that accurate, go figure....
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture296.jpg
After marking the new bend location, the bead roller was fitted with the tipping die to relocate the bend...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture301.jpg
Now that the tipping die has left a crease indicator on the bottom side, a hammer and anvil is used to flatten out the incorrect crease...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture303.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture304.jpg
For a much better fit.....
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture307.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture308.jpg
With tail gate test fitted....
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture295.jpg
Well that's about all for this go round, will start welding the tail pan in next time...
Holly cow! Great work. I would have probably junked 2 of those wrong pieces trying to put the correct bend/roll in it. :LOL:
The tail pan and rear opening were prepped a couple days ago by painting some epoxy on the surfaces that would be adjacent to each other after welding for some rust prevention. Tonight holes were added to the tail pan for plug welding, and the panel fitted up..
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture311.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture312.jpg
Here's the epoxy, I use a letter A size (.234) drill bit for my plug welds, and to clean the epoxy from the adjacent panel, I use a letter A that has been flattened and backfaced to form a cutter similar to an end mill. It cleans the paint well, and hardly touches the metal on the adjacent panel..
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture314.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture315.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture316.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture318.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture321.jpg
Butt welding the vertical seams...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture319.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture320.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture322.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture323.jpg
Note the views from the back side show full penetration welds. Next, grinding the welds in prep for the next set of weld dots..
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture325.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture326.jpg
....and finishing the vertical welds...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture328.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture329.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture331.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture332.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture333.jpg
Thought I'd spend some time this evening to see how I could clean up these corners....
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture331.jpg
Trimming out some of the excess...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture334.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture335.jpg
Used the roll former die to make the radius....
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture337.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture338.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture339.jpg
Fitted, welded, and looking much better!
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture340.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture342.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture343.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture344.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture345.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture346.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture347.jpg
That looks amazing! I just got a new welder so now I have to practice to see what heat and wire speed to weld what. :LOL: Anyhow, you do great work! Keep at it!
Thanks! I'd say your welder setup is key to getting the good results, good luck with it!
Moving on to the right side.....
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture348.jpg
Trimming the excess for the radius piece to fit in....
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture350.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture351.jpg
Trimmed to fit....
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture352.jpg
Welded in place...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture353.jpg
Welds dressed
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture354.jpg
Yeah, I like this look much better!
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture355.jpg
Wish I had learned to weld like this...!
Beautiful work once again, Robert!!! What are you using to "dress" the welds in the small area?
Where I normally use a cutoff wheel to knock down the proud of the weld, this corner is much too tight for that, so the majority of the weld is removed with a carbide burr in the die grinder, then switched to a 3/4" dia sanding drum on the die grinder.
I was wondering if you used a carbide bit to finish those hard to get welds. Definitely top notch work!
Thanks! Not too much shop time this weekend (hey, it is Mother's day), but I did manage to test fit the tailgate to see how well it matched the new radiuses added to the opening.
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture356.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture357.jpg
There are a couple areas the gaps will need tweaking, but the "new" corners should help add to the other subtle changes.
Been a busy couple weeks working on honey do's, painted the inside of the garage so I could hang a canoe for storage, so I could paint the inside of the car trailer that it used to be stored in, so we could sell the car trailer. Late today, found a bit of time for the wagon, working on some of the plug welds for the rear valance....
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture355.jpg
The ones at the bottom attach to two braces underneath, and fitted the tailgate to pull in the valance to match the bottom of the tailgate...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture358.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture359.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture360.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture361.jpg
Great work Robert, its' those little pieces that drive you nuts but they make all the difference in the world.
Worked today to finish up the weld seam on the passenger quarter panel. First, I wanted a profile template to check the crown of the panel. As the rear half of the driver's quarter was NOS, this would make a good template....
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture362.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture364.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture365.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture366.jpg
Adding an alignment mark to the quarter....
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture367.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture368.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture369.jpg
Using the profile template against the welded seam of the passenger side, we can see the low area along the center. This is a typical problem with using "half quarters", welding through the center of panel tends to flatten out this low crown area. A full quarter with the welded seam up top where there is a bit more crown tends to not have as much of a "flattening" effect.
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture370.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture371.jpg
Finishing the welds and checking with the profile template.....
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture372.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture374.jpg
Still shows some more crown needed through the middle of the panel, will do some more planishing tomorrow...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture373.jpg
Next on the list for the wagon, the upper gate. It has a similar stance as the lower gate when closed, and as such, water lays along the inner window frame at the bottom.
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture375.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture376.jpg
Ice pick test....
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture378.jpg
The lower bend is fairly flat, going to a tipped flange in the form of an arc, the inside has some compound curves going to the window opening flange...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture379.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture380.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture381.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture382.jpg
I'll get this bottom cut out next week and attempt to form it in one piece, flange to flange, for a easier job of replacing..
Very nice work, and cool little template you made up to check your quarter curvature!
Excellent metal work, Robert!
Thanks guys!
Took the upper gate off tonight...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture383.jpg
My tool of choice for removing spot welds is a 3" x 1/16 cutoff wheel. I also use the premium wheels made for stainless steel. It's worth the extra money when you don't have a brown cloud in the shop, like the el cheapo wheels leave, nothing but resin wearing away.
The upper layer of metal will start to turn blue when it gets thin and hot, letting you know you're getting close to the next layer. When you have a blue circle with shiny metal in the center, you are now in the second layer, grind around the blue a bit more and pry the layers apart..
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture385.jpg
With all the spot welds removed, here's what we find inside...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture386.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture388.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture389.jpg
Note the deep pits. The big problem with just welding a hole closed is you don't know where the next pit is lurking, ready to break through your new paint.
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture391.jpg
Funny, with all the rust and scale inside, then you find this area of bare steel nice and shiney..
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture387.jpg
The inside will get media blasted to insure there is no more lurking issues and then epoxy primered before re-assembly.
Here's a better look at the shape we'll need...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture392.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture393.jpg
Spot welds can sure be a PITA if you're trying to save the outer piece. :LOL: Nice work! I like the cut off wheel approach too.
It seems every time I used one of those spot weld "hole saw" cutters, I ended up spending more time repairing what I had cut through too far, so I have been using this method since.
To start the layout on the new metal, I wanted to find the center of the radius along the window opening. By holding a sanding disc on the flats and scuffing, it showed the edges of the radius...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture396.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture397.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture398.jpg
Then laid out a pattern to be able to measure from the bottom crease...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture400.jpg
....and transposed it to the new sheet...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture401.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture403.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture404.jpg
The top edge was trimmed to size and the tipping wheel used to fold over the welding flange...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture405.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture407.jpg
Comparison....
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture409.jpg
The bottom was marked with the tipping wheel and folded in the apron brake. Then trimmed to size, again using the tipping wheel to fold over the welding flange...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture410.jpg
It's real close right now, just needs a bit of tweaking.
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture412.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture413.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture414.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture415.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture416.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture417.jpg
This was made using 18 ga, I think if I had the factory 19 ga metal it would have formed much easier..
WOW... I still find that work to be amazing! Thanks for sharing also.
Holly cow! You do impeckable work! That is awesome!
Thanks for the comments guys. Sorry for the long hiatus, been too many distractions...
Media blasted the inside of the upper gate to clean it up before welding the new part on. Unfortunately this revealed more in the way of pits, through holes, etc., so it now looks like more fabrication....
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...Picture419.jpg
Time to attempt some dies for the Lennox. Tonight's choice is some 1" thick phenolic sheet...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...cture077-2.jpg
Here's the profile we're looking for...
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...cture079-2.jpg
The dies installed in the holders....
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...cture080-2.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...cture081-2.jpg
An offset bend was added to the sample 19ga in the brake, then the first of three passes.....
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...cture083-2.jpg
Final pass.....
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...cture084-2.jpg
Dies held up well....
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...cture085-2.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...cture087-2.jpg
Safety tip of the day, 3" roloc discs do a good job of shaping phenolic, so skin is no match.... (note thumb in above pic)
Where my "test sample" was made initially with straight bends in the brake, the actual piece on the lift gate is not straight, so the bends on the "good" piece will need to be bent using the tipping wheel.
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...cture090-2.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...cture089-2.jpg
The profile needs just a bit of tweaking, and I may try using a piece of metal inserted in a band saw blade cut to sharpen up some of the details.
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y16...cture091-2.jpg
Thanks, Robert! Every post is a Masters class in metal work and you always take time to take such great pics of it! Awesome!