Thread: Best brand of tools for the price?

Tweet

I have a link somewhere that talks about who makes what. for instance Proto is same manufacturer as stanley, just a higher grade steel and heat treat due to the industry they are targeted at. Snap-on makes their own hand tools, and just cause I know how stubborn people can be, I just called them on the phone and confirmed. they use a different steel recipe and heat treat than crafstman, thus the thinner profile for same strength (that's from me, not the guy on the phone at snapon).

by the way, I ran the sanded down craftsman reject past the guy, yeah, he was laughing. I probably made his day.

I am guessing cornwell, who has been around for a long time, doesn't have much presence in my area, I have never seen a truck here, only north on the I5 corridor somewhere. but they are great people. I bought a complete 3/8" drive set off of ebay, missing the 10mm socket (replaced with taiwanese crap) I tried to get ahold of local distributor and couldn't. I called the company and explained, they sent me one in the mail no charge.

Craftsman are fine for home mechanics, I have a bunch. I think as a professional you really do need to be able to have them replaced without leaving work.

Red

have always found snap-on to be over-priced i stick with matco

Originally Posted by DennyW

And don't forget to buy the BFH.

my favorite tool!

I'm not a dog, I don't chase trucks!
I have plenty of Snap-on, Craftsman, a few Matco, I'm a mile and a half to Sears for 40 years, it always there, and I don't like the tool guys coming by and trying to get people to buy things they can't afford, seen it to many times. Ask your tool driver, he probably has a set of tools he's trying to get rid of, that someone bought and can't pay for.
Pat

Originally Posted by HemiTCoupe

I'm not a dog, I don't chase trucks!
I have plenty of Snap-on, Craftsman, a few Matco, I'm a mile and a half to Sears for 40 years, it always there, and I don't like the tool guys coming by and trying to get people to buy things they can't afford, seen it to many times. Ask your tool driver, he probably has a set of tools he's trying to get rid of, that someone bought and can't pay for.
Pat

I agree here...buy only what you can afford. Most trucks offer a line of credit to finance their tools and boxes, BEWARE. As is stated above there are many "repos" available for a reason. It is very easy to get in over your head if you don't keep your wits about you. When I was in the fab shops I made it a rule that if I had to borrow it more than about 3 times then it was something that I could use, but I didn't need it until I managed to put back enough to buy it outright. It is really complicating if you decide to leave an employer when you still owe the tool guy money.............

Lowe's carries a tool line called KOBALT and I hear they are made by snapon. Dunno if that is true, but they look nice and I think they are priced quite competetively compared to craftsman. My brother in law is a bonafide wrench, and he swears that S/K makes the best ratchets hands down. I happen to have an S/K and when I reach for the cheater bar I make sure the S/K is on the recieving end, not the craftsman.

Speaking of craftsman, the finish quality of their tools has really gone down in the last ten years or so. I REALLY hate the anodized numbering on their sockets. Expose them to anything corrosive whatsoever and the numbers are gone forever. A few years ago, the wife bought me a small craftsman screwdriver set ( or some such set ) and they actually made her pay extra for the guarantee! Boy was I pissed! Told her to go and get a refund on the 'guarantee', and if they gave her any slack about it she would just return the whole set. Nearly swore off craftsman after that, but hey.. I have both a craftsman red, and wrinke brown finish tool box so what the hey. Their ratchets are definiely crap. I've had several work poorly straight out of the box, so to speak. Never had a problem with sockets or wrenches.

For screwdrivers, Klein do seem to hold up better.

You will have need for the occasional crimp... the best crimpers I have ever used are LOBSTER. Awesome crimpers, simply wonderful.

No craftsman is complete without a LEATHERMAN hanging on his belt. I currently have a leatherman CORE , which I believe is the replacement for the SUPERTOOL. Nice tool: stainless steel, quick release for the blades, but the design does pinch the hand a bit if you bear down on the pliers hard.

I think I can sum it up as such: your tools don't need to have one particular brand name. some brand names are better than others, such as Klein screwdrivers, strippers and cutters, S/K ratchets, etc.

It is nice to have the expensive tools, but who are you really trying to impress?

Originally Posted by BigTruckDriver

Snap-On is a distributor, NOT a manufacturer, all they do is sell. Danaher makes the tools for Snap-On, MAC, Matco, Craftsman Professional and NAPA. The only difference is finish and name. Blue Point, Evercraft and Craftsman are a second line. Not as slim, professionals don't want a bulky tool to get into tight spots. Finish is not as nice, but same lifetime warranty.

.

Where in the heck do you come up with this stuff??? I've been through a couple of the plants where some of the Snap-on stuff is made!!!! Trust me, Napa and Craftsman tools are not near the quality of Snap-on and Matco.... I've been using them everyday for many, many years....

This is from the Snap-on site..... I guess you better tell them to stop manufacturing....



Company Profile

Snap-on Incorporated is a leading global innovator, manufacturer and marketer of tools, diagnostics and equipment solutions for professional users. Product lines include hand and power tools, tool storage, diagnostics software, information and management systems, shop equipment and other solutions for vehicle manufacturers, dealerships and repair centers, as well as customers in industry, government, agriculture and construction. Products are sold through its franchisees, company-direct sales and distributor channels, as well as over the Internet. Founded in 1920, Snap-on is a $2.5 billion, S&P 500 company headquartered in Kenosha, Wisconsin.

Mission
The most valued productivity solutions in the world.

Address
Snap-on Incorporated
P.O. Box 1410
Kenosha, WI 53141-1410, U.S.A.
262-656-5200

Originally Posted by BigTruckDriver

My info could be dated.... I'll let it go ,dont have time

No kidding!!! Snap-on has been making hand and power tools for many, many years. Nothing new here. I went through the Kenosha, Wi. plant 20+ years ago and watched the manufacturing process.....

Originally Posted by HemiTCoupe

I'm not a dog, I don't chase trucks!
I have plenty of Snap-on, Craftsman, a few Matco, I'm a mile and a half to Sears for 40 years, it always there, and I don't like the tool guys coming by and trying to get people to buy things they can't afford, seen it to many times. Ask your tool driver, he probably has a set of tools he's trying to get rid of, that someone bought and can't pay for.
Pat

Yup, usually from some stupid kid who bought $15,000.00 worth of tools while he was going to the Vo-Tech school that Daddy paid for, then when he got out of school and actually got a job turning wrenches he discovered it was way too hard of work!!!! Never had a tool truck guy hold a gun to my head and force me to buy anything!!!! Same thing as saying it's Citi-Banks fault when some idiot runs up $20,000.00 worth of debt on his credit card then discovers he can't pay the bill?????

I have no idea where you guys are buying your tools at, but I've had the same Snap-on Dealer calling on me for 25 years. He's never forced me to buy a thing, but has always gone out of his way to get me just what I need for specialized tools and never given me a moments grief about replacing broken or defective tools. Better know exactly what you need when you go to Sears and by the Craftsman stuff cuz it's a cinch the brainless twit at the cash register is totally clueless on offering any sort of good advice!!!!!

Two things: Craftsman tools of today are NOT the same quality they were in past years. I have some old craftsman sockets, rachets, wrenches, etc, and they are all steel and still look and work great. The replacement sockets and such that I have bought in recent years look and feel differently, and the chrome plating chips easier (look at the ends of your sockets where they go on the nuts.....they chip right there) They are also not as smooth to the touch.

Secondly, Kobalt tools seem to be pretty good. We have been buying some of them since Lowes is a stones throw from our shop and open till 9. The quality seems to be pretty good.

I also like Gearwrench products. Their racheting tap and die set is the best thing since sliced bread. For the first time in my life I can tap a straight hole.
See picture of it below. Buy yourself one, you'll love it.
Don

Originally Posted by Dave Severson

No kidding!!! Snap-on has been making hand and power tools for many, many years. Nothing new here. I went through the Kenosha, Wi. plant 20+ years ago and watched the manufacturing process.....

A lot of Snap on power tools are now made by diffrent companies they have boughten / bought into over the years ( somthing like 50 companies now ). Most
Air tools are IR's with fancy grips.
but ALL snap on hand tools are made by snap on themselves. I have a friend that is a Snap On distributor

Originally Posted by DennyW

Don, you going to finish up that finish on the bores ?

What chew talkin' bout Willis??

Don

Guess I'll stick to using a thread chaser on existing threads....Running a tap through tends to remove a bit of metal from the threads... I've got holders for my taps that are 3/8" drive and use a ratchet....

Originally Posted by Dave Severson

Where in the heck do you come up with this stuff??? I've been through a couple of the plants where some of the Snap-on stuff is made!!!! Trust me, Napa and Craftsman tools are not near the quality of Snap-on and Matco.... I've been using them everyday for many, many years....

This is from the Snap-on site..... I guess you better tell them to stop manufacturing....

I SAID IN MY FIRST POST "I WAS NOT SURE BUT REMEBERED HEARING THEY WERE REJECTS" THIS WAS 15 YEARS OR SO AGO AND IT LOOKS LIKE I GOT THE NAMES MIXED UP, EXCUSE THE F OUT OF ME!!!!!!!

Now, I am no expert on turning wrenches, I dont turn them day in and day out and dont have the money or need for snap on.The different brands are not etched in my brain like yours. If what I keep finding on google is correct it was another top name brand that I heard about 15 years ago, I think they ride around in a truck too. Anyways here a little something I read thought it might be useful.Dont know how true it is some engineer claimed the writing but it pretty much the same story I kept finding


"Here's something that you might be interested in:
Someone wrote [in part]:

... but I never could figure out who makes the [Craftsman] hand tools.

To which someone else replied:

I'm not the final word on tools by any means, but since I work in the business, I've learned a little bit about it. Okay, here's more than you ever wanted to know.

Lowes now (as of earlier this year) is selling a line of Mechanics Tools called Kobalt which is made by Snap-On. They are good tools.

Home Depot's Husky brand is made by Stanley Mechanics Tools, a division of the Stanley Works. Husky are also good tools and have a good lifetime warranty (they'll even replace your broken Craftsman with an equivalent Husky).

Until 1994 or so, Stanley also made Sears Craftsman tools. Sears Craftsman is now made by Danaher Tools. They beat out Stanley on the contract over price. Danaher also manufactures MatCo Tools, the third largest player in the Mobile Automotive industry (behind MAC and Snap-On). Odds are, if you own any Craftsman tools that are older than about five years ago, they were made by Stanley in plants in Dallas, Texas, Witchita Falls, Texas, and Sabina, Ohio.

Stanley also owns MAC Tools and manufactures MAC tools in the same plants. Now here's the kicker: MAC Tools, Proto Tools (a very expensive industrial brand), Husky Tools, and, (prior to five or so years ago) Craftsman Tools are all made from the same forgings in the same plants. Proto is unique because it goes through addtional testing and certification because it is used by NASA, the military, and industrial customers (including General Motors).

There are three MAJOR players in the USA mechanics tool business: Stanley, Danaher, and Snap-On. Stanley and Danaher (almost identical in sales revenue at about $28 billion each) are the biggest followed by Snap-On. Each of these three manufacture and sell tools under a variety of brands (there are many other brands that Stanley makes that I haven't even named). The quality between these three manufacturers is roughly the same. I know its a bit of a let-down to hear that, but its a simple fact.

There are a hand full of other minor players (Vermont American, etc) and an endless list of Taiwanese import tool companies (some of which Stanley own as well as Danaher to serve the lower end consumer import brands at WalMart, etc). How do I know all of this? I work for Stanley Mechanics Tools, specifically with the Proto Industrial brand. I personally do not think that MAC, MatCo, or Snap-On branded tools are worth the extra markup since they use the same forgings and manufacturing processes that make Husky and Kobalt and pre-1994 Craftsman. Where you need to pay attention are things like ratchets and torque wrenches. There are different specifications of ratchets and you do pay for the difference. Some mechanics require a finer, more precise ratcheting mechanism than guys like me who just bang around in the garage on the weekends.

By the way, Metwrench is basically considered a "gimick" infomercial tool brand that is not considered as a serious competitor to Danaher, Snap-On, or Stanley. Then again, IBM once didn't see Microsoft as a serious force in the personal computer business. Hmmmm....

Then there was this discourse on FACOM brand tools:

> FACOM has been around forever. French company, says "American" in the name
> though I forget the whole acronym.

FACOM is Franco-Americaine de Construction d'Outillage Mecanique. French for "French-American Mechanical Tool Manufacturing". Got points in my french class for that.

> It's now one of the largest tool conglomerates in Europe.
>
> SK, I think, is an American company that recently has had a large part of
> its stock purchased by FACOM.

FACOM owns S-K outright. You'll notice (if you look through the catalogs from preceeding years) that the tools are becoming more and more alike. The S-K "pro" screwdrivers are now FACOM ergotwist screwdrivers. The "tuff1" ratchets are S-K pro ratchet handles avec FACOM innards. FACOM's ratcheting flare wrench now has S-K stamped on the side of it. I don't like it because we could get FACOM tools from S-K dealers for over 10 years, but now they're getting more and more reluctant to give us FACOM stuff, they'd rather sell S-K stuff. Which is why you get S-K catalogs instead of FACOM. If you specifically request (demand) a FACOM catalog, you get their _american_ catalog, which is abbreviated, along with a note to contact Griot's Garage. I've asked a French friend to get me a French market FACOM catalog, as they have all the good stuff that hasn't yet been absorbed into the S-K line. Ultimate Garage is a FACOM dealer as well as Griots, and I've been told (by richard?) they've got a catalog, dunno if it's FACOM's, but I'll order something and find out.

I was also wondering what the deal was with the S-K foundry? Presumably they still make some stuff stateside? No? I know there are others not mentioned, Cornwell has a foundry in Ohio, I think?

I'd kinda doubt that Williams uses the _exact_ same dies for Koalt and Snap-On. I compared the Kobalt combo wrench to one of my Snap-Ons, and they aren't the same. The Kobalt handle is pretty much rectangular in cross-section, and really does hurt your hand when you pull hard. The Snap-On is more rounded. As well, the Kobalt is visibly looser on the fastener. Maybe these are Snap-On rejects? Can't explain the handle differences, though. The breaker bars seem to share the same grip, though, it just seems the kobalt doesn't have those nifty machined indentations at the base.

I know Stanley owns Mac and Blackhawk (didn't know about Husky), but the Blackhawk stuff doesn't seem similar to the Mac stuff. These look awfully different to be from the same dies, shape wise. So the price difference is different steel in the better tools? Surely they can't be charging Mac prices for better plated Blackhawk stuff?

> FACOM also owns (large parts of) USAG (Italian?) and Beissbarth...

didn't know this. I'd like to find some USAG tools, just to try them "