God Bless Gen. McChrystal I am glad he spoke up against the President.
We finally had someone with some BALLS.
Kurt
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God Bless Gen. McChrystal I am glad he spoke up against the President.
We finally had someone with some BALLS.
Kurt
i could be wrong but i think he was sick of the BS .just a guy that did his job and told it the way it is. last of a rare breed .at least he did not call them clowns:3dSMILE:
Looks like the Commander in Chief wants only Indians that keep their mouths shut and nod their heads, Yes :(
Yep; Obama Bow's down to Musulim nations.
And Gen. McChrystal knew bowing down is below a general.
Maybe he should run for President.
Just the way I see it.
Kurt
Oh and he doese not mind wearing an American Flag on his suite either.
Yep the United states needs to give better incentive to keep these big companies from leaveing.
Either that or don't let them do bussines in the USA.
Just like Gores Catchup companies, most of which were outside the US.
Less Import and more export, and stop giving aid to all these countries that want
to kill us or don't like us. Let some one else police the rest of the world.
Kurt
This is from the Obamanation's apology tour:
What do you think would happen if you were to dis your companies CEO to a large magazine and mention that his aid is a clown? being a second offence, would you expect to be fired? On many different levels it's important to maintain unity.... if you disagree with the boss you need to hold your tong. if you can't do that then you have the option, and obligation, to quit your job. If quitting your job becomes your choice then you shouldn't expect to eat at the company picnic and receive a Christmas bonus.... but apparently some here feel they should??
sick of whiners,
Russ
And from an evening out with the "little" woman:
General McChrystal did no wrong as far as I can find. He had some aides that spoke some "trash" when a lib media person was able to catch some good bored soldier talk. That writer from Rolling Stone Rag - may have a short career. Unfortunately for the Genereal - he was the boss and that's where the buck stops. He and his aides will be most likely counting snowshoes in Nome, Alaska if they are even able to stay in the military
MacArthur would be proud.
well he left his job before he got fired ? or am i missing something here? should he got the bump from his job well maybe BUT this is a war i if your not happy with you leader and his clowns come by and pull your chain and you watch lives end then i think he did have a right to say what he did and obimba had a right to let him go if thats what you want to think ? i would be happy to keep the general and let go the president:D nice IC2 :3dSMILE: what a ass kisser :3dSMILE: laid down and let them all roll over us :mad:Quote:
Originally Posted by lotsatoys
As much as I dislike Obama's politics and self serving approach, as well as his apparent un-AMerican actions, it is a soldier's duty to obey orders and to support the commander in chief. That is a basic rule of the military. He has the right to speak out only after he leaves the service. He broke a cardinal rule.
Joke! The Prez has the thinnest skin I've ever seen. He has the worst polices I've ever seen as well!
Quote:
Originally Posted by btsave
I can agree with that, but I'm sure proud that McChrystal had the guts to expose the jerks. Lest we forget, a commander's first and foremost duty is the welfare of the men he commands.
I am with you on that NTFDAY.
Kurt
With 24 years military service, and rank of Chief Master Sergeant (E9) I have known a few generals. Most have had great concern for the people serving under them and respect for the people above them. One of the rules all military men and women must observe is respect for their superiors, the position if not the person. I have also learned that you have an obligation to speak up to your superiors if you disagree with them. This should be done in confidence, if after listening to you, your superiors choose a different path, legal of course, then you are obligated to make their decision your decision. You do not run them down in public nor to your troops. If you are not willing to do that, then you need to find a new job. Whether he was right or wrong, Gen McChrystal screwed up by saying what he did in public and really gave the president no choice.Quote:
Originally Posted by btsave
Pat
what exactly did he "expose"? he exposed nothing except that he had total disregard for his duty as an officer.Quote:
Originally Posted by NTFDAY
Russ
If I were President and an underling did the things he did, he would be in my office, on the carpet, and lucky to leave with any rank at all. You simply can't have men, who should know better, shooting off their mouths just because they disagree with some policy. You expect more out of Generals, especially ones whose command is on that level.
It's easy for us to sit here and second guess the decisions our elected officials make, but none of us are privy to the global pressures they are under or the politics they have to play to keep us one step ahead of our foes.
McChrystal was a loose cannon and had to go, via quitting or being fired.
Don
Here's an angle I doubt anyone has considered. McChrystal has decades of service, and is no dummy. I'm thinking this was all done on purpose to force Obama to order him to retire because the marching orders cooked up by the White House and VP "Bite-Me" for the Afghanistan operation would have put McChrystal in an unwinnable situation that would leave a stain on his military career.
From the lowest grunt to the highest brass it's a soldier's right to complain about the clowns running the circus, but you don't do it in front of civilians.
This very thought occurred to me. But, since he has stepped on his goober string before, I think he just did it one too many times and in a fashion that could not be tolerated. If he wanted out, all had to do was announce his retirement for personal reasons. Others had mentioned General MacArthur as a comparison, I think General Patton would be a better choice. Brilliant military mind that let his mouth get him in trouble.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Antagonism
Let's hope that General Patraeus and the troops in theater can be successful. Afghanistan is a tough nut to crack, just ask the Soviets and others before them.
Pat
Sometimes things need to be said in a open forum like that so that people can see what's really going on.
If he would have gone up against Obama in private, Obama would have tried to make his whole team look incompetent.
See the Politicians are supposed to take recommendations from their Generals, obviously they are not doing that!
If they were following his recommendations, the interview would have been a lot better.
Politics can get a lot of soldiers killed as we seen with Vietnam.
And if some of you have noticed the other side is not exactly playing by the rules either.
And Gen. Mc Crystal knows this, he's the one that’s been on the ground over there the whole time.
Never the less Gen. Petraeus is a great man and I hope he leads our troops and our country to Victory.
Kurt
I know where you are comming from Louey.
They vote everyone pay cuts then give them selves raises.
Go figure!!! Politics at it's best.
Kurt
The saddest part of ALL OF THIS, is that it ONLY boils down to "money movers" and "getting re-elected" - - - - NOT winning the WAR or protecting our Troops!:mad:
I agree Mello
Tough decision for POTUS to make, here is a quote that might offer some insight...
“The amazing thing about it is there’s no complaints from McChrystal or his staff about the administration on any substantive ground. After all, McChrystal and his allies won the argument within the White House. All the criticisms — of Eikenberry, of Jones, of Holbrooke, of Biden — are actually just immature and arrogant snipes at how annoying Team America (what, apparently, McChrystal’s crew calls itself) finds them. This is not mission-first, to say the least.”
So what some of you are saying is all the military personal should be "YES" men/women and shouldn't speak the truth when it involves not only my child but 10's of thousands of other people children, wives, husbands, sons, daughters, and other friends & family members. Personally I'd rather be told the truth by someone who knows what is truly going on & has the guts to say it rather then a "NOBODY" who doesn't know squat about not only fighting a war let alone running this country.
Having Obama as the head of our military is about as stupid as me doing brain surgery.
Just because I seen it done on the health channel doesn't make me a doctor even if I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express.
Oh and personally I would have told anyone who had the gonads to tell me I "HAD" to apologizes to the Pres. to go(& I'm saying this nicely so it doesn't get deleted) go drop dead. Because those words would have NEVER came out of my mouth in a million years, I have TOO much pride to let some NOBODY tell me what to do. Especially when most of the world & more then half of Americans thinks he's is a failure in every way. But then what do we expect from a NOBODY who has basically no political background, no military experience and during the time he was a Illinois Senator he didn't show up to do his job more then 50% of the time. But then what do we expect from a guy from Illinois's World Famous "CROOK" County...joe
Geez Toomany... what are your true feelings??? BTW... I agree with your thoughts and think that the only thing General MC did wrong was voice his opinion in the wrong venue. No matter what happens he still has his pride for saying what he thought needed to be said. Look at it this way, he'll retire, write a book which Hollywood will make a movie of and he'll be rich! Sounds like a plan to me and then he can tell Mr. Obama to... anything he wants at that point! Greg
First of all, The Obamination has never had a job in his life where he had to do a budget, hire and administer people and work 8-5. He was a community organizer:LOL::LOL:Quote:
Originally Posted by TooMany2count
Next - he, if I recall had a 143 day job as senator before he started running around the country for the presidency, then of that 50% of the time noted he was at the Senate, much of the time he voted 'Here' rather then commit himself to a position. While in statistics it doesn't indicate a position, it does show attendance. And yes, I am a 'birther'. He hasn't yet nor has anyone else convinced me that he is Constitutionally qualified or electable. If he ever produces a real birth cert, then I'll change my mind.
His direction in Afghanistan has cost increased numbers of American and other NATO countries young folks lives. We haven't had very many soldiers from my area killed in either Iraq or Afghanistan, but there were two local kids killed in the past week. Sad!!
I hope General Petraeus has the cojones to get the job done here. He made it happen in Iraq.
Q: "Why did Barack Obama take up golf?"
A: "Because he heard it was a sport where you could improve your lie."
mike in tucson
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluvelle65
Greg, what do you think he got($'s) from the Rolling Stone Rag??? This could be the plan, he's no fool.
It would be nice if the Prez would approach the unemployment problem, oil leak problem, border problem, and all the others with the speed and vigor he uses to go after a General and his staff over some off-the-cuff comments. JMO.
Here is a quote from Breitbart site written by Jeff Dunetz:
"McChrystal is a Four-Star General, a position you do not achieve by being an idiot. Today’s military leadership is well schooled not only in war-making but in diplomacy. He knew what the content of the article would be. He also knew that the article would lead his own dismissal (or the proverbial resignation letter where he says he’s quitting to spend more time with his family).
The Rolling Stone interview highlights the difference in the leadership styles of the President and the General. When this President faces a crisis, he looks for someone either internally or externally to blame. On the other hand, the General sees the War in Afghanistan reaching a crisis point because of the way it is being waged, rather than looking to find a scapegoat in his ranks as Obama would do, McChrystal found a way to let the country know what is really happening, while at the same time redirect any criticism for the war effort, away from his men and on to his own wide shoulders.
Notice that even in his apology above,the General does not take back the comments, he simply apologizes for making the comments. The Military commander was sending his troops and the administration a message. To the troops he was saying ” I have your backs even to the point of hurting my own career.” The message for the administration was, “Your way isn’t working, let us do what is necessary to win this war. Even though this was a violation of the Code of Honor, the General’s statements were a service to America and to his men by confirming what we all suspected, the President and his administration does not have a clue."
The General does not need nor got any payment from Rolling Stone, he will do fine with his military retirement, his speaking fees, and probably a book deal on his mission (not his interview). mike in tucson.
The Prez should be reading the battle plan, not rolling stone!!!!
The General knows he needs 50,000 more troops right NOW to continue this war and he knows that by the 4 -6 months Prez will take to think about it we will be defeated-----
You got that Exactly right, Jerry.
Kurt
A friend sent this to me, it's a good read.
Chilling Letter from Proctor & Gamble to Obama
Who would have thought, and yet many are thinking it.
By Lou Pritchett, Procter & Gamble
A LETTER FROM A PROCTER AND GAMBLE EXECUTIVE TO
THE PRESIDENT*
THE LAST SENTENCE IS THE MOST CHILLING
Lou Pritchett is one of corporate America 's true living legends- an acclaimed author, dynamic teacher and one of the world's highest rated speakers. Successful corporate executives everywhere recognize him as the foremost leader in change management.. Lou changed the way America does business by creating an audacious concept that came to be known as "partnering."
Pritchett rose from soap salesman to Vice-President, Sales and Customer Development for Procter and Gamble and over the course of 36 years, made corporate history.
AN OPEN LETTER TO
PRESIDENT OBAMA
Dear President Obama:
You are the thirteenth President under whom I have lived and unlike
Any of the others, you truly scare me.
You scare me because after months of exposure, I know nothing about you.
You scare me because I do not know how you paid for your expensive
Ivy League education and your upscale lifestyle and housing with no
Visible signs of support.
You scare me because you did not spend the formative years of youth
Growing up in America and culturally you are not an American.
You scare me because you have never run a company or met a payroll.
You scare me because you have never had military experience, thus
Don't understand it at its core.
You scare me because you lack humility and 'class', always blaming others.
You scare me because for over half your life you have aligned
Yourself with radical extremists who hate America and you refuse to
Publicly denounce these radicals who wish to see America fail..
You scare me because you are a cheerleader for the 'blame America '
Crowd and deliver this message abroad.
You scare me because you want to change America to a European style
Country where the government sector dominates instead of the private sector.
You scare me because you want to replace our health care system
With a government controlled one.
You scare me because you prefer 'wind mills' to responsibly
Capitalizing on our own vast oil, coal and shale reserves.
You scare me because you want to kill the American capitalist goose
That lays the golden egg which provides the highest standard of
Living in the world.
You scare me because you have begun to use 'extortion' tactics
Against certain banks and corporations.
You scare me because your own political party shrinks from
Challenging you on your wild and irresponsible spending proposals.
You scare me because you will not openly listen to or even consider
Opposing points of view from intelligent people.
You scare me because you falsely believe that you are both
Omnipotent and omniscient.
You scare me because the media gives you a free pass on everything
You do.
You scare me because you demonize and want to silence the
Limbaugh's, Hannitys, O'Reillys and Becks who offer opposing,
Conservative points of view.
You scare me because you prefer controlling over governing.
Finally, you scare me because if you serve a second term I will
Probably not feel safe in writing a similar letter in 8 years.
Lou Pritchett
*
*
This letter was sent to the NY Times but they never acknowledged it.
Big surprise. Since it hit the Internet, however, it has had over
500,000 hits. Keep it going. All that is necessary for evil to succeed
Is that good men do nothing.. It's happening right now.*
http://www.snopes.com/politics/soapbox/youscareme.asp
Lou,PLEASE run in 2012 !
I'm probably one ot the most anti-war, anti-government, anti most everything that interferes with my life.... But I do remember from my time in service that this post from Pat is how a real soldier behaves, and a general is nothing more or less then a soldier, right?????Quote:
Originally Posted by Stu Cool
If you were a VP at Chebby and went around telling everyone that Ford was a better company and had a better car they'd fire yer butt, too!!!!!!:LOL::LOL::LOL:
But of course, like everything else, it just becomes another political issue and everyone lines up behind their favorite party, CNN or FOX!!!!!!
But if you found out that all the chevys were gonna be crushed because of something wrong with them, would it then be wrong to say something if your in charge of the assembly line. I don't want to see that happen to our soldiers.
Kurt
I guess this is why people don't discuss politic's.
I am all for our soldiers, and the general is one of our soldiers.
God bless them all.
This is from one of our local stations and in response to their son's death in Afghanistan last week:
http://wnyt.com/article/stories/S1623848.shtml?cat=300
These folk are sure not an Obamanation supporter (as are most of our North Country folks here in NY State)
[QUOTE=Dave Severson;390498]I'm probably one ot the most anti-war, anti-government, anti most everything that interferes with my life.... But I do remember from my time in service that this post from Pat is how a real soldier behaves, and a general is nothing more or less then a soldier, right?????
I agree with most of the comments but I think this is wrong.
"A general is nothing more or less then a soldier, right?????”
Dave, everyone is entailed to their opinions but to say a General, is nothing more or less then a Solider, in my opinion is wrong. I spent 3 years in the Army; my deceased brother was in the Army for 6 years the last year was spent in Viet Nam. I know you were in Viet Nam and you deserve respect like everyone who has ever spent time in the service and especially war. I talked to a WW2 veteran yesterday when he was taking me to the pre-op for yet another surgery, I asked if he still knew his serial number he went right into US…….. I gave him my Ra……. number we talked about how that is one number you will never forget he was 82 years old volunteering at the Hospital. Dave when you say a General is more or less just a Solider you’re not giving due respect for them devoting their career's in the Armed Forces. I know I couldn’t have spent that much time in could you? You must not or you would have stayed. I know you were injured as well as my brother in-law. My brother in-law passed away this past November he was disabled but the complications from Agent Orange caused his death.
Obama could not or would not wear the flag on his lapel. Was that a form of insubordination or disrespect? A person that has no leadership qualities should not be the Chief. He did not spend one day in the Military to even know what the roles of ranking personnel duties are. I hear a lot of I this and I that but includes us or we when he says we have to tighten our belts and make sacrifices and we have a tough battle ahead of us. One person said you don't get to be a General by not being a smart person but we have been shown that a person can be President by not having the Military knowledge.
I have a Nephew that is getting reading to come home after his third time in Iraq his rank is a Colonel and he has been in the service for 18 years. Not everyone is qualified to give so much. I knew the chain of command and I respected it. But I don’t respect someone who has no expertise over the experience. The Presidents office was bought the General paid his dues for his position.
If this portion is construed as political and needs to be deleted I could or the Moderator could. I wasn’t trying to go too far but if I did I could get it off.
I believe his main campaign promise was to get us out of war. He spends money left and right when he should be creating jobs like the WPA or anything to give people pride to make money instead of continuing to extend unemployment. He said he was one who did not vote for war on his campaign trail, how far has that come? My self I think a commander in Chief should have some back grown in the Military before sending troops anywhere.
In a War Country where people had no money, my Niece was in the Army and was guarding Iraqi civilians to empty water bottlers with expiration just to give them a job to make money. There could there be jobs where people could get paid. They could pick up trash on the road ways, I could think of several things that people could be paid for instead of feeling like they were taking a hand out after their jobs were done away with.
Richard
IC2 I read the story from your link, it's a sad thing.
My opinion would be to restart the draft bring in another 500 thousand or a million to get it over. There are so many people that do not have relatives over there they do not even have a clue to what is going on. There are so many people out of work in this Country that could use the money and make an all effort just like WW1 and WW2.
Richard
The bottom line is that this "war" can never be won, by anyone. It has been going on for centuries, for reasons none of us will understand. The logic of the combatants is so deeply entrenched in "religion" that they will go to any end to meet their goals.........whatever those might be.
If the Russians, who play by none of the politically correct rules we are shackled by, left with their tails between their legs, what hope is there for us to achieve "peace" in that area? It is like trying to maintain law and order in a Ghetto, all you can hope to do is keep somewhat of a lid on things to keep it from getting way out of hand.
In the mid Eastern countries there is no clear cut description of who the enemy is...........it can be Women, Kids, or the guy who was your supporter yesterday. We've all seen the images of them cheering for us one day and burning the American flag the next.
Don