Thread: Hunting rifle

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Ive not done a whole lot of deer hunting, but a 308 will drop what you need!! A nice remington 700 has been used forever with great results. if you hot rod one out it`ll do whatever you need, just ask Carlos hathcock, proven shot`s well over 500 yards.JMO

The 45-70 is a great old round, and in its day was hard to beat. It was designed to shoot Black Powder at a time when brass case's were just becoming the way to go, and even today is at its best when loaded with Black Powder and a really heavy bullet like the 530 grain Creedmore or Postel type of target bullet. The is a type of shooting were the 45-70 excels today and that is BPCRS that would be "Black Powder Cartridge Rifle Silhouette" here the 45-70 is one of the leading and most accurate calibers shot. At this game 1/4 of the targets are shot at a distance of 500 Meters, thats over a quarter of a mile. The target is a life size Silhouette of a Ram and weighs around 60 lbs being made from a high impact type of steel, the ram not only must be hit, it must also must be knocked over to score a hit.

Now with that being said the 45-70 was built and designed for Black Powder, when loaded with smokeless powder it turns into a real bear. In smokeless loads almost all of the ammo Companys use a 305 to 350 grain copper jacked bullet. a long shot for this bullet and smokeless is a 100 yds with any hope of accuracy. The 45-70 has a trajectory like a rainbow and in a light rifle like the "Guide" guns the recoil will just eat you alive. The Marlin you mention as well as most short barreled Guide guns weigh in right around 7 to 7 1/2 lbs. The early 45-70's wieghed as much as 16 lbs and in the BPCRS the rules call for a weight of 12 lbs 2 oz. Recoil is manageble in those heavy rifles in a 7 1/2 lbs rifle it is not fun.

You would be much better served with as your first rifle one that is fun to shoot and has recoil that you can deal with. A really good choice has already been mentioned and that would be the Remington Mdl 700 in .308 caliber. This is the caliber of choice at many many long range and position matches. It is routinly shot at distances up to and including 800 meters and loaded with the right bullet excells at this distance even today with some of the more modern and higher velocity rounds. Other rifles to look at in this caliber would be Ruger Mdl 77 and the Winchester Mdl 70. These are three rifles cabable of Very Good accuracy and at a reasonable cost. Good Luck!!

Roland

Thanks for everyone's feedback. I actually have a few ww2 rifles .303 and 7.62 x 54 cal, as well as 22's, shotguns, etc. An old neighbor friend lives in a fairly wooded area where a short light gun has it's benefits. I was thinking .45 -70 because I wanted a powerfull load for close range pig shooting, and also something that would work up to 200 yards for big game such as elk, and bear(not for sport, but self defense). I've been reading up on overall versatility and heard the guide guns properly equipted with a scope and lever revolution high grain(400+) will shoot 200 yards well. I also heard the recoil is extreme, but when used with a pachmyer decelerator butt pad, it lessens the kick, and with 300 grain loads it's not too bad. I wouldn't be using this one for the rifle range other than scoping it in. I like the lever action design as well. I was tempted to go with an old m1 garand or 30-30 lever action, but figured I will pick up an older winchester 30-30 for the collection at some
pointbut wanted the knock down power to stop the wild boar in it's track, since they come out of nowhere, and move quite fast! All of the above sugestions are appreciated, just wish I could collect them all. Something about gun tooling has always facinated me. My prizeof my current rifles is a 1900's pump action winchester .22 that was my uncles grandfathers' gun. Just a very cool small fun rifle.

A friend of mine is needing some quick race cash. He offered me a .300 Weatherby with 350 rounds of new bought ammo. 500 bucks for the whole deal. I should be jumping on this huh? My problem is I do not hunt, or shoot that often, just throw in a safe. I sold 17 of my 20 guns about 10 years back. But man what a deal that is.

You guys are too damn modern for me....You really want to go hunting, take along a Vintage Fusil Musket....No scope, just a long barrel with a single site at the end. heavy 64 caliber musket ball and some black powder







Who needs anything more, honestly too much modern artillery takes the fun out of the actual hunt.





Bill S.

I agree with Canadainal and Pope;

Hang on to that .22 Winchester pump, that's a great little gun. I have one, and also a South American copy that's a lot of fun to blast away at pests with.
I don't think the .50 M2 comment was meant to be a serious consideration. $8-$10 a round is a bit stakey for the deer woods! My .308 Norma is too expensive to buy factory ammo, reloads are better anyway.
I'm a lifelong fan of the .303 British, but anybody who thinks it can perform as well as a 30-06 had better buy himself a ballistics table and look 'em both up. I overload my P14 to the point that the rounds would spring the action on a Lee-Enfield, and it's still not up to the '06, either velocity or energy.
Whatever you decide, don't overgun yourself. It's no fun shooting a cannon that beats you silly every time you pull the trigger. Recoil doesn't bother me at all, but some guys a lot bigger than me are afraid of it.

Forget the dang guns. Put some challenge in the hunt, use a bow!!!!...and no crossbows allowed....

the .50 cal comment was a joke. Sorry, guess it didn't translate well.

besides, who wants to hump in a mile just to grab the kill?

Originally Posted by firebird77clone

the .50 cal comment was a joke. Sorry, guess it didn't translate well.

besides, who wants to hump in a mile just to grab the kill?

I got the joke part! My neighbor has a .50. I had a hell of a time lifting the barrel out of his safe. I've never shot it yet, but seen the distances they are targeting for fun, not to mention the cartridge. He was thinking of selling his due to California's ever changing laws. Anyone who has ever lifted one or toted one around would get it right away. Also the rounds are like 10 bucks a piece. They look like small tank rounds!

I used my 30-06 in Wyoming and killed and nice 6 x 6 elk at 180 yards and use my 30-30 for deer in the Adrondicks.

Originally Posted by chevy 37

I used my 30-06 in Wyoming and killed and nice 6 x 6 elk at 180 yards and use my 30-30 for deer in the Adrondicks.

Nice Elk! 30-06 will definately be on the short list!

I also like taking my ww2 stuff to the range but they are also heavy to be lugging around for hunting, but very good weapons. I definately thought about a 30-06 and a 7mm, but came back to the 45-70 because of the nostalia associated with them. I figure I won't get more than two shots, and the recoil thing can't be worse than my Finish 7.62 x .54 which has a metal but plate with no recoil absorbsion. That sucker starts to really make you flinch with the trigger pull being heavy and the promise of a bruise after your 4th or 5th shot!
The main reason for the big caliber is to knock down and keep down the animal. Up in Colusa County the area we hunt is full of ravines and mountains. It's nice to knock down the deer before it takes off and gets lost in the brush. And if we come up on a pig, I'd really like it to go down!

Vara i may be wrong but didnt the xm shoot a 223 or was it still the old mini 30 bullet?

the 30 is close to a 30-30 but the 223 is way way faster

Mustang i like the old flintlock, ive got a thompson center 50 cal with 4 power scope, have never shot a deer with it(special season) yet but ive shure raised heck with the gophers around here with it

Sorry Vara but you have your facts completly wrong when you combine the .308 or 7.62 Nato round with the 30-30. There simply is no way to compare to the two. The .308 DOES NOT have anywhere near or close to the "ARK" using your words as the 30-30. You should know that as a former "ARMY SNIPER" and as a Former Army Sniper you would have trained extensively at Fort Benning with the .308. That is were the Army Scout Sniper school is located, and the .308 Winchester is "STILL" the weapon of choice for all training in the initial phase of training at Benning.

Accuracy and bullet flight is always--- "ALWAYS" about Balistic Coefficient of the bullet and Muzzle Velocity. In the 30-30 a round that was the first smokeless round EVER designed in 1894. Had to by design use a flat nose or rounded nose bullet because it was built for the new Mdl 94 Winchester Lever Gun, a rifle with a tubular magizine with the nose of each bullet resting on the primer of the round in front of it. Flat nose and round nose bullets are inherently very low in balistic coefficient also the muzzle velocity of the 30-30 is also very low even today. Any 30-30 bullet that is adequate for hunting at 150 or 170 Grns has a muzzle velocity around 2200 to 2400 FPS in the 30-30. The commomly used bullets in the 30-30 have a BC of around .250 to .280 or so, using the very best technology of today Hornady makes a "Flexi-Tip" bullet that can have a BC of .330 that is the best that can be hoped for in this very old cartridge. So in the 30-30 with a 100 yd zero the bullet drops as much as 2 1/2 Feet at 300yds and over 6 feet at 400 yds.

Compare that with the .308 round one of the most accurate and flat shooting rounds out there because of its superior Ballistics. BC in the .550 range are easlily obtained with over the counter componenets. This and when loaded up to the potential of the bullets at Muzzle Velocity's for the BTHP "Boat Tail Hollow point Match Bullet at 170 grns with a BC of .540 loaded to 3200fps and with a 100 yd zero this bullet drops only 14 inches at 300 yds and at 500 yds it is down only 41 inches while maintaning 2478 lbs of bullet energy. Which is more than the 30-30 has at the muzzle.

The 30-30 certainly has a place today in hunting, but one place it for sure doesnt have a place is in comparing it to the .308.

Roland

PS, Vara after posting this and then seeing your last post about the M 60 are you saying that the M 60 used the same round as the 30-30?? That can't be right I must not be reading your response correctly. I am for sure as a "FORMER ARMY SNIPER" you would in fact know that the M 60 did in fact use the 7.62 Nato round or .308!!!