Not much to argue with in your two posts Dave. I've learned that anyone who starts a discussion about this stuff with "The last eight years......" is not going to say anything intelligent. Not defending Bush here, just observing that that person is too mentally lazy to think for themself. Where we are today has been brewing for nearly 75 years. We've been gradually inching toward being a society of serfs to an "elected" royalty. This year we pass the tipping point where 50% of the people in this country get some sort of "check" from some level of government.

Many brilliant thinkers have written books forcasting these outcomes; Friedrick Hayak in "The Road to Serfdom" and Ayn Rand in "Atlas Shrugged". But maybe a quote from a genuinely sincere President would put a finer point on it;

"You cannot help the poor by destroying the rich. You cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong. You cannot bring about prosperity by discouraging thrift. You cannot lift the wage earner up by pulling the wage payer down. You cannot further the brotherhood of man by inciting class hatred. You cannot build character and courage by taking away people's initiative and independence. You cannot help people permanently by doing for them, what they could and should do for themselves." - Abraham Lincoln. (thanks for passing this on Mike)

Ironic that Obama has chosen this man to hold up as his "model" eh?