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Just wondering what you guys thought might be the preferred finish hone on a SBF, .030 over, forged pistons, gapless 2nd ring, 10.5 CR. On E-85 with no bottle..... Street use mostly, other then a bit of Friday night grudge race action occasionally....
Thanks
I think the rings determin the hone needed?
Have to look it up for your specific rings.
Sorry I dont have a better answer for ya.
total seal tells you how they want the wall s honed but i would hone it not much dif then i hone any wall for molly rings i start on a fresh bore at 70 150 280 then just a wee bit of the 300 and follow up with the plateau brush less your guy is using diamond
Yeah, that's about all Total Seal sez too, though they don't really consider going to 300 as essential.... Just wondering if anyone might have found anything special that worked good with the ZG 2nd....
i do not care for them rings for the builds i build. you can go to 280 and go right to a plateau brush has alot to do with many things the plateau brush and if its a hard stone or soft stone how much pressure and the make up of the iron of the block
For whatever reason, the SBF's seem to like the ZG 2nd ring.... Guess I can't tell you why, but they work good. The Mustang has 25,000+ miles on it since it was built and still has less then 4% leak down...so no complaints from me!!!! I've heard others with the same dislike of the rings on big blocks--Ford, Chevy's, and Mopar--Wonder what the difference would be that they seem to work well in small blocks, and not so good in the big blocks?????
PS-- Pat, do you run the low tension oil rings on your big blocks?????
no i have not run a low t oil ring on my cars . did machine up a 530 that used 043 rings and a low t oil ring was used i would not use the low oil rings on the4.600+ big bore less dry sump or pump. i do not use the z gap rings more for the $$ deal were guys just will not pay that for rings . i have a customer we have talk about the Z gaps but never used them. i can not see it he putting down big nos and i do not think there a good deal for him. i used them in a 455 buick build
I don't use nitrous, but I do know of a couple guys running nitrous that are using the ZG 2nd ring on forged pistons,,,, Haven't really noticed either of them having any particular problem with them.... I got started with them years ago in a 302, liked them, later put them in a big block Ford and had nothing but grief with them...Took them out after about 10 passes. Used them on all the SBF's since for racing and hot street cars. Now, going to run them on the street in a cruizer.... Guess will just do the block setup and hone like the race engines.....
We put the low tension oil rings in the 501 this winter, ask me in a couple months how I like them....:LOL::LOL::LOL:
well in time he may not hear me and used the z gap rings but they are pushing down 500 hp of nos and re ring the engine every year i just can not see it i did use them come to think about it in a 4.600 bore short block but it was stuff the guy pick up told me to use:D i think they had a ss top ring? i do not know how well they worked
Thanks again for the help, Pat!!! Sure wish you lived a bunch closer and I could just have you do all the machine work... The guy I'm using now does good work, but doesn't really have the experience or confidence to decide for himself what method would be the best.....
Hmmmmm. Maybe we should add on to the shop and offer it to you?????;):) This area really needs a good machinist that can get things done in a timely manner!!!!!!!! Heck, I even have an apartment in the basement you could rent cheap!!!!!!!:LOL::LOL::LOL:
well it would be nice to find a place warm all year round:3dSMILE:hell were your at it colder then were i at now :LOL: when you get your spot in TX let me know i may jump at that:DQuote:
Originally Posted by Dave Severson
That will be next fall, Pat.... Lots of room down there, you'd be more then welcome.Quote:
Originally Posted by pat mccarthy
PS--Only 20 miles from the dragstrip in Baytown where the run the Nationals.....
ford saids that you hone each cylinder for 45 minutes. with any grit as long as it is 45 degrees.45 forn45.on my 302 i used gapless rings with no problems but on my 428 used regular cast iron rings with no prolem. but i do not run nox don't beleive in it. the 302 was 12.5 to 1 and the 428 was 11.5 to 1.
any stones ?? are you sure on that if you did that with a an 131 sunnen stones your rings would never seal ?? and the bore would be about 010+ over in 45 mins with my hone machine but i only bore and hone engine every day under 2.900 bores to 4.625 i have never been told that one:3dSMILE:
I've ran Fords for years, can't imagine what you would use or why you would possibly run a hone in a cylinder for 45 mins!!!!! More concerned about the finish then the time......
if you run a hone in a stock 302 block for 45 min non stop you will put so much heat in the bore it will look like a old coke bottle :3dSMILE: them bores like to get out and move around a weee bitQuote:
Originally Posted by Dave Severson
[QUOTE=DennyW;359567]((We put the low tension oil rings in the 501 this winter, ask me in a couple months how I like them....:LOL::LOL::LOL:))
So how do you like them Dave ?
QUOTE]
So far so good on the ring set up.....Going to do a leakdown on it some night next week just to see how things are inside....
with out deck plates 003 under piston to wall i hone wet with sunnen AN stones i like the soft stones with my machine i run the 131 stones up to less then 002 .then a AN 200 stone up to 001 .then a AN 300 to size then 4 strokes with a sunnen plateau brush that run on the AN head or on bigger bores i use a brush . if deck plate i will hone about 004 out . as for time it takes to hone one hole to size that as alot to do with bore size the make up of the iron . there is cool down so the holes do not move . i hold my bore tapper under 0003 :3dSMILE:i bore any thing that comes thru my door last week was a 3 hole geo tracker engine was like a toy.i bore harley jugs bore and hone them with TQ plates if i am taking just out .010 i hone them not bore them and that moves out good with the 131 stones but they break down fast but is the best stones for moving iron out of the bore if not cutting it out with the boring bar. i like to bore :3dSMILE:i do alot of V8s bbc and sbc i am setup to deck plate them from 4.00 to 4.625 :LOL i put sleeves in as well with my boring bar . but the honing is the back killer
[QUOTE=DennyW;359567]((We put the low tension oil rings in the 501 this winter, ask me in a couple months how I like them....:LOL::LOL::LOL:))
So how do you like them Dave ?
QUOTE]
Denny,---
Did the leakdown check on the 501, not a lot of passes this year due to some tranny issues (Flowerglide, to be expected).... Anyway, after 60 passes, less then 4% leakdown on the worst (#7) cylinder with the gapless / low tension ring combination!!!!! Good news for me!!! Guess it works on big blocks, too!!!!!!!! Can't really positively say what it did for performance, made a few other changes on the engine last winter besides just the rings.....
What the car needs is a tranny that lives!!!!! :LOL::LOL::LOL: More performance isn't really necessary, already have to throttle stop the dang thing to keep it at 9.90!!!! Or, find a bunch more money and run 8.90's!!!!:LOL::LOL::LOL:Quote:
Originally Posted by DennyW
The way money is these days, guess I'll just be happy that we can afford to still run a car!!!!!!
well i work in RA:D with iron bores with silicon carbide to a 12 RA then a ultra -finsh plateau brush. works for me over a 100+ bores cant be wrong :LOL:
Well, if the car were all mine, I'd lose that frickin' glide in a heartbeat and go with either a G-Force or a Lenco!!!!! Just run Quick 8 and leave the throttle stop at home.....unfortunately, it's not all mine....nor am I the one stuck with all the tranny bills!!!!!!!:LOL::LOL::LOL:
yep thats about the std hone job with me i use it on the air cool engine could not tell you what ring they use moly or just iron. up to the big bore hp stuff and the stock builds i do . i have customers reuse ring sets with good luck:HMMM: so i not going to try any thing new :3dSMILE:Quote:
Originally Posted by DennyW
that what ford states in there manuals. i've never done it that way but i do use the courser stones and varsol.have not done any i a few years. is varsol still avaible?????