Thanks ... do you have a link to Secret Audio on the web ??
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Thanks ... do you have a link to Secret Audio on the web ??
Google is your friend ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Deuce
Tim, no, I'm not set on getting the chassis from the same people that builds the body. The reason I asked the N&N body is because I've read lots of very positive comments about the quality, fit, and finish on numerous boards. The 1st post in this thread mentioned another opinion that nobody touched on except to say that P&J makes a good chassis. It referred to a Show Me Rod & Custom body and P&J chassis. I also considered an N&N body and a Roadster Shop chassis. I think you're referring to the N&N Fiberglass body and chassis combo, correct? To help clarify that, N&N does not produce the chassis, they are made by another company near N&N. They use American Stamping rails, build the tubular center crossmembers, and build the front & rear crossmembers based on your suspension choices.Quote:
Originally Posted by SirSpeedy
One of the things I like about the N&N body/chassis combo is that N&N doesn't put the floor into the body until after your chassis is built and delivered to them. Then they mount the floor to 'your' chassis, and then they attach the floor to your body. This seems like a good process to me, I'd be interested to know what you think, care to comment?
Mike
My Outlaw body was built on an Outlaw chassis. What appealed to me about a body on a rolling chassis from Outlaw was the fact that they assemble your body on your chassis, and as a result, you do not have to shim the body to get the doors to fit correctly. I found the Outlaw frame well made and quite strong. We have not talked much here about Outlaw bodies, but they are super straight. My painter was impressed with the quality of this body and said it took less than a cup of bondo to prep the entire body. You can always tell an Outlaw body because of the 3 3/4 inch chop. In addition, the body moulding around the windshield has been smoothed out and the rear window is from a '33 Chevy which was grafted into the original body on which the molds were taken. If I build another '32, I would not hesitate to order another one of these bodies.
In reference to glassing in the floor on your frame vs any other '32 frame or fixture, I think that might be a little over rated.
The cars I have built have been Wescott, Brookville, or Ford bodies. I built a 5w using a Gibbon body about 10 years ago.
A '32 frame that is assembled in a fixture, to the correct dimensions should be the same as any other '32 frame assembled in a fixture to the correct dimensions. I have been to Wescott's shop, and the fixtures they use to install the floor look like a short section of a frame, the cowl portion to the rearmost body mount.
I haven't been to Brookville, but Scandinavian in Huntington Beach assembles B-ville bodies, and they have '32 rails, cut down from the cowl back, on rolling fixtures to assemble those bodies.
So maybe if it is acceptable for the two best know body manufacturers, who are respected for there quality, to assemble bodies on a random frame or fixture, it must be fine. So I guess my thought process is why would the body manufacturer need or even prefer your frame, if they are assembling their bodies on a proper fixture that ensures accuracy and consistency from body to body?
As for shimming, closed cars aren't that big of a deal to shim up - ALL roadsters of ANY brand need extensive shimming to get everything, door gaps, beltlines, hood lines, fenders to fit - those door hinges have no adjustment - all adjustment is in shimming the cowl and quarters up/down front to back.
I understand the position that any body assembled on a frame/jig that is "to specs" should fit any other frame that is also "to specs", but the specifications have manfacturing tolerances. While they will be close I would challenge that no two frames are going to be truly identical, hence the need for shims to get the gaps right. This is the benefit of having your body assembled on the frame it will ride on - tolerances are accounted for in the body assembly.
From the August '08 build article in Street Rod Builder, N&N not only mounts the floor with the body on the frame, they also build the doors up from inner & outer panels clamped in place on the body to make initial gaps right. They offer a complete chassis/body combo as Mike points out, but I am pretty sure that you can also carry in any quality chassis, for example a roller from Pete & Jakes for them to match up your body to. Others may be as good or better, but from what I have seen so far their approach is a pretty solid value for the dollars they charge.
There is a tolerance, yes, but in the Y plane (vertical) the rails are all the same - there are only 2 people stamping them, and Lobeck and SAC weld up rails - the vertical profile of all 4 major sources of '32 rails(ASC, Weimer, SAC, Lobeck) are the same - certainly within .100" - I've had them all in my jigs and they are all very high quality. So if the width of the frame from the centerline is the Ford spec - they should all be the same. I cannot imagine being able to build a '32 Ford with any body and chassis, and not have to place a single shim under the body anywhere. I've built too many, and know too well how difficult it is to fit a hood on one of these cars. Maybe the definition of "fit" is a little more broad for some of these companies claiming "no shims"
My point is simple - Gibbon, Ravon and others have trumpeted the great benefit of glassing the floor in on the frame the body will ride on - this is not new - I know nothing of the NN bodies - but this is the same deal.
TONS of super-high quality cars are turned out by So-Cal, Lobeck, Brizio, SRRC, Cali Street Rods, Limeworks, Circle City, every year with bodies and frames that have never seen each other until they both arrive at the shop of those guys.
One issue with reproduction frames is the width. If you are going to run fenders ... the frames are too narrow. The fenders hang on the rear body panel and then drop down to the frame.
http://hotrodders.com/journal_photos...1913591141.jpg
With the frame too narrow, you can end up with a space in between the fender and the frame. I have seen this gap as large as 1/2 of a inch. Then the running boards are not out far enough to line up with the outer edge of the fender.
As " flexible " as the fiberglass bodies are :rolleyes: I am with SirSpeedy
I do not really see the advantage of the body being built on the chassis it will finally be on. They move around a good bit ... and some SMELL pretty rank after sitting in the hot sun all day. Most of the fiberglass body guys suggest that you NOT paint your fiberglass cars a dark color.
The ONLY advantage I could see is that with the new body sitting on the intended chassis ... it might cure up better sitting on it than sitting some where else.
I helped a friend with a chopped 32 3W Wescott body ... and we installed it on a original 32 chassis ... and it fit like a glove. It barely was wide enough to sit down over the rails. Bolted it down ... with webbing in between it and the frame and everything was just right.
________________________________
For those of you who have never built a 32 Ford :)
The body actually sits over the frame and hangs over. The floor is recessed up into the body about a inch and a half. This photo is all I have of showing the way the floor and sub rails are recessed. I know, black floor in the 3W does not make for the best photo.
http://hotrodders.com/journal_photos...1431460000.jpg
Hey Deuce, is that a Serta or a Sterns & Foster that you laid the body to rest on? :LOL:
I suspect that the appeal of a body assembled on it's eventual foundation is based in axiety over the possible unknowns of shimming to the less experienced builder. Learning to shim can be intimidating, and certainly frustrating as you find that you end up redoing certain portions of the job as you add more components (especially when getting the front sheetmetal on) and what looked "good" before ends up being the victim of stacked (pun intended) tolerences.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Parmenter
So the hood on these cars is a challenge? haha :)
Simmons Beautyrest World Class ... :) only the BEST for my old coupe to lay on :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike52
Actually, it came out of one of my rental properties ... :HMMM:
One thing that bothered me about my fiberglass 3w was something that Deuce mentioned.........the glued in windshield. To remedy this, I bought a windshield frame and hinges, chopped the windshield frame and had it chromed, and fabbed up all the bracketry to make it work. I'm happy with it now although it's not finished, I drive it between improvement projects. By the way, it's a Rat's Glass body.
http://img180.imageshack.us/img180/4...llsmallcs2.jpg
My research tells me that the folks who say that use a cheaper resin that doesn't have an adequate Heat Distortion Factor (HDT). That tells you whether or not your body is going to be stable when it sits in the hot sun. Low temp resins (general purpose) will deform under heat, and the glass cloth pattern can print through the paint, or panels can deform. That's why some body manufacturers recommend that you "sun cure" your car, and/or you not paint it black. The "no dark color guys" probably used a general purpose resin, what I call a "camper shell" quality. Cheap, but not the best for a car - especially a dark one. Bottom line, if the correct resin is used, the car is "cured" when you get it, and you can paint it any color you like. If I bought another 'glass body, I'd ask the manufacturer about the HDT of the resin. If I got a blank stare, I'd go elsewhere.Quote:
"Most of the fiberglass body guys suggest that you NOT paint your fiberglass cars a dark color. "
You know deep in your heart that the cheaper bodies used the cheap resin ... that's one way they can be sold cheap ...Quote:
Originally Posted by Henry Rifle
Gastrick, I like what you did! Looks good! Sometime in the future I'd like to do it to mine! BillQuote:
Originally Posted by Gastrick
WELL ... it has been 6 months ...
What did you do ??
Buy a N& N or a built car ?? :3dSMILE: :D
damn you guys arent messing around are you!!! series money tied up in these years of cars!..................:::::::::::::::::::sigh:::::::::::::::::: maybe one day!
Thanks Deuce for waking me up.Quote:
Originally Posted by Deuce
I'm building it!!! The best thing I've done was to get to know Cecil Taylor at Hercules Motor Car Co here in Tampa, he's known for his fantastic '37 & '34 Ford Woodies and a former NSRA 'Give-away' car. Thru Cecil, I ordered a complete TCI chassis with the chrome/stainless steel package. It will be powered by an LS1/4L60E combo. The body was ordered last week, I'm going to N&N on Aug 3rd to pick it up, I'm taking the chassis and will spend a few days there doing a few extra things. Yesterday, Cecil ordered a 3 piece Rootlieb hood w/25 louvers on the sides and a Brookville grille shell. I'll try to attach a few pics of the progress so far.
Mike
wow its like christmas!!!!
A few more pics,
Yes ... Cecil Taylor is a very talented guy. :D
Looks like you have been spending a good stack of " Fun Stamps " but you are getting good quality stuff.
Good Luck with your project ... I just know it will be exactly like you want it and be worth to you ...all the $$$ and trouble when it is completed. :D
Post photos as progress goes on. YOU KNOW we love photos.
Randy
Randy, thanks, I'll update my thread, "32 Coupe project begins", with these pics and more info, will use that thread to keep everyone informed and up to date. Stay tuned for lots of questions.
Mike
Looks like you've been supporting the 1-800-Hot-Rods businesses quite well!!!! The economy needs it.... Betcha the ROI beats last year's 401K!!!!!!
You'll B glad ya went with an N&N.
Duane is the man.
Have done 5 of his bodies and never had a problem.
Painted 1 BLACK, and 1 dark blue and they came out great.
Good luck.
Tell him Don for AZ said Hello.
We purchased a BeBop body and have been satisfied. I am with you on the windsheld frame but you can buy an aluminum one from DJ's that trims the car out nicely (we did).
You probably can buy cheaper. We chose to build because I wanted my son to learn something and for the experience.
Are there any more updates to this thread or did it move over under a new title?
New thread, as noted on the previous page http://www.clubhotrod.com/forums/sho...project+begins but hasn't been updated since the new body followed Mike home....Quote:
Originally Posted by florida
I do not know of N&N. I always liked the Redneck original height coupe. New owner has company now. Did I miss anyone mentioning Bebops. I checked them out again this year at the Nats. Tenn people. Talked to people at fairgrounds no bad stories.