Ballast Resistor? or Not?

SBC, running HEI type dist with external coil. Manufacture of dist said no ballast resistor required. I know, or think, voltage was dropped on point type dist to extend point life. I am using an Accel stock configuration coil, 35,000 volt, with no ballast resistor. Now after about 1 year I believe it is going out. After running awhile, engine quits. Will only refire after about 5 mins to cool off. Yesterday I managed to catch this at the shop, and found spark very weak. After cooling spark was much better, still not as hot as should be. My Question is without ballast resistor is this going to shorten life of coil. 12 volts contstantly or I believe about 9.6 with resistor.:confused:

you need 12 volts with a HEI no resistor just make sure your coil is ok for a HEI accel makes many coils or did .many will not work for HEI use

Chuck the Accel coil and IMHO anything else Accel. A stock coil will give you just as good service and longer life. IMHO. high voltage coils are only as good as the spark plug wires they're feeding.

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Originally Posted by NTFDAY

Chuck the Accel coil and IMHO anything else Accel. A stock coil will give you just as good service and longer life. IMHO. high voltage coils are only as good as the spark plug wires they're feeding.

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yup last accel coil i use got some air .i do not know if it was a world record or not :3dSMILE: they had some of there stuff on E bAy and i talk to a customer to get the old points out of his car has his kids left the key on all the time and smoke the points out . so the accel stuff was not so hot. after i put more of my money in it to get it to work was the last time i will use accel stuff .way back when i use the stuff it work was thinking it would be ok for him WRONG WRONG it costed me way more money then it was worth . if i added up my time and parts i needed to get the new blem stuff to work i should of just pick up a MSD and put it in for free OH well live and learn :)

I went through a couple of Super Coils and a couple of spark plug wire sets before I realized that Accel's inexpensive stuff is pure junk and much worse than OEM. I wouldn't waste money on anything that says Accel.

I bought 2 OEM distributors and gutted them. I added the petronix HEI adaptors along with the petronix 7mm wires and coil...all for the stock look. I am extremely happy with the performance and quality. I use them for drag racing and they are good to 6500 rpms. Maybe more but never shifted more than that.

Modern (HEI) ignitions do not need a ballast resistor; they can handle cranking and running voltage AOK.

Kitz

i've only worked on small block chevys so the only ballast resistor i've ever heard of cost me $300 to replace in my big screen lol

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Originally Posted by kitz

Modern (HEI) ignitions do not need a ballast resistor; they can handle cranking and running voltage AOK.

Kitz

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Question might be more acurately be, will running coils, external, that were designed for use with points, and ballast resistor on full 12 volts lead to coil failure? I know the dist doesnt need voltage drop. I am using aftermarket high voltage coil, in std round package. Don't really want to use the high voltage race type, as I was after the vintage points and coil look. With the firepower and reliability of hei. LOL. Although after 3 days of f.....ing with this thing I don't believe it's the coil. It was weak, but I have other, as yet undetirmined problem.

i think the chrysler coil for a hei but did use a ballast on hei? but a ford coil may work ?.i do not think a points coil will not work with a hei or buy a msd coil if your looking for a round can coil that will work with out a ballast i know accel.msd will as well as mallory used many of them. . i do think any stock points coil could be used for hei use ? i never had a coil go bad till the last accel.. i did . i used the gutted GM HEI with a laser box .accel dist with a MSD box. merc boat stuff thurnder bolt as well with mallory coil. i used the most all them.i all ways use the coil they told me or what coil they said would work on the coil listed buy maker and part number

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Originally Posted by pat mccarthy

i think the chrysler coil for a hei but did use a ballast on hei? but a ford coil may work ?.i do not think a points coil will not work with a hei or buy a msd coil if your looking for a round can coil that will work with out a ballast i know accel.msd will as well as mallory used many of them. . i do think any stock points coil could be used for hei use ? i never had a coil go bad till the last accel.. i did . i used the gutted GM HEI with a laser box .accel dist with a MSD box. merc boat stuff thurnder bolt as well with mallory coil. i used the most all them.i all ways use the coil they told me or what coil they said would work on the coil listed buy maker and part number

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Yeah, I figured stock coil would burn out, so I went with accel. I hadn't bought anything from them except some plug wires since mid 70's. Did not like the made in china. Have you had ocassion to buy a round can coil, such as msd or pertronics recently? Made in usa? I don't know that it makes much of a difference, because everyone is trimming production cost. And thanks for the info.

yep i used about 4 of the MSD s in the last year there made in MEX icano

weather you need a ballast or not depends on the coil requirements.
In required cases it is so you don't over heat the coil.

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Originally Posted by 1wild&crazyguy

weather you need a ballast or not depends on the coil requirements.
In required cases it is so you don't over heat the coil.

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That was my thinking. I guess that's were mfg tech support might be helpful. Although sometimes those people don't know the correct answer. Best bet is run ballast resistor to coil and full 12v to dist. If spark is good, that worry is over. Other than 1 more ferrin part to fail. :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by dlotraf33

That was my thinking. I guess that's were mfg tech support might be helpful. Although sometimes those people don't know the correct answer. Best bet is run ballast resistor to coil and full 12v to dist. If spark is good, that worry is over. Other than 1 more ferrin part to fail. :rolleyes:

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I agree.

It's usually better run one when it's not needed than it is to not run one when it is needed.

with a ballast, when the rpm's go up... so does the voltage anyhow.

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Originally Posted by 1wild&crazyguy

I agree.

It's usually better run one when it's not needed than it is to not run one when it is needed.

with a ballast, when the rpm's go up... so does the voltage anyhow.

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if you set it down under 12 volts its never going to 12 or past that . if that was the case your points would burn up ??????????????? IF hei coil is made for NO ballast then it should not need one

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Originally Posted by pat mccarthy

if you set it down under 12 volts its never going to 12 or past that . if that was the case your points would burn up ??????????????? IF hei coil is made for NO ballast then it should not need one

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Very true, but are any of the coils in the round can made specifically for hei and thus 12v contantly. I don't know..... Just a question. Hmmmmmmmmm time for some research.

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Originally Posted by dlotraf33

Very true, but are any of the coils in the round can made specifically for hei and thus 12v contantly. I don't know..... Just a question. Hmmmmmmmmm time for some research.

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yes MSD makes one

Ok, still not real sure as to answer. Here is what I found.
MSD Blaster II and III coils instructions say points and factory dist run ballast resistor. In another place they say if dist does not require ballast resistor don't run one. ???????????

Pertronics, Flamethrower 40,000 volt coil is internally resisted so can be used on many ignition systems. Directions and specs say nothing as to ballast resistor, 45,000 volt coil is available in 1.5 and 3.0 ohm models.??????? Oh 40,000 volt coil is .6 ohm

Accel says any coil with less than 1.0 ohm resistance needs ballast resistor.

phone support may lead to better info. It appears most of the round can coils are made to replace point type coils and electronic ignition systems. None specify HEI, with the exception of the conflicting mention by msd.

Electrical I know, not necessarly automotive, but theory and how componets work. I know somthing like a coil is designed to opperate a certain voltage, or range. If you design a coil to produce a certain output voltage with a ballast it will produce that voltage, increasing the input voltage will increase output voltage. But if one were to build to min specs, to reduce production cost. They might not handle very much voltage in excess of design spec. You would think in the case of an ignition coil with the numerous applications today the mfg would give at least a max input voltage, or better a min and max range that would not damage the coil and produce the desired output voltage. I did discover that the accel coil I purchased was a .8 ohm coil designed for points application. You would think that would be on the box, or on even a small instruction sheet in product. Neither were present, and of course the idiots a most auto parts stores anymore need an application for a set of cork sbc valve cover gaskets. Before I purchase another coil, and I think I'm looking at MSD, I wan't to hear it from them, that no ballast required, and that coil will operate without failure on constant 12 volt operation. But on the other end a coil designed to output 40,000 volts with a ballast could be run with a ballast on hei type, just run 12 volts to dist, and dropped voltage to coil only. You would think the aftermart market manufactures, knowing we are modifying our vehicles would maybe figure we were smart enough to understand their specs, and not just say it'll work buy it. :confused:

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Originally Posted by pat mccarthy

yes MSD makes one

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Yeah it looks like that is the way to go. They had more specs and info on their products that the othes I looked at.

Oh BTW, really like that "IRISH DIPLOMACY" my great, great, grandfather was an O'Brian and mother always told me I got the Irish temper. :D

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Originally Posted by dlotraf33

Yeah it looks like that is the way to go. They had more specs and info on their products that the othes I looked at.

Oh BTW, really like that "IRISH DIPLOMACY" my great, great, grandfather was an O'Brian and mother always told me I got the Irish temper. :D

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i would not know any thing about the IRISH temper thing i have a bit of german:D No temper i just do not forget:D and that would be the IRISH i have alot of that :LOL: i have used many of the MSD blaster coils with the 6als the pionts just will not take 12 volts full time that what the ballast ressistor from welding the points . the chevy cars used resistor wire for the old points when going to a hei or MSD this wire get removed so it gets 12 volts done a hand full this way

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Originally Posted by pat mccarthy

if you set it down under 12 volts its never going to 12 or past that . if that was the case your points would burn up ??????????????? IF hei coil is made for NO ballast then it should not need one

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wow ha ha uhhh....
No, it's not gonna kill the coil running less than required voltage.
btw my ballast lowers/limits the voltage and DOES increase with rpm to a point.
What can burn a coil is too much current.
like I said 1st off...run what the coil manufacture recommends.

btw don't take general statement and spread it to cover every coil under the sun...We know HEI's take a straight 12 volt lead.:rolleyes:

Good luck, i'm out of this from now on.:cool:

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Originally Posted by 1wild&crazyguy

wow ha ha uhhh....
No, it's not gonna kill the coil running less than required voltage.
btw my ballast lowers/limits the voltage and DOES increase with rpm to a point.
What can burn a coil is too much current.
like I said 1st off...run what the coil manufacture recommends.

btw don't take general statement and spread it to cover every coil under the sun...We know HEI's take a straight 12 volt lead.:rolleyes:

Good luck, i'm out of this from now on.:cool:

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ok yep your the one that did say use a basllast on HEI or did i miss some thing ???? his old coil was for a points dist ?????not hei

Well, I am by far no expert on any of this, but I have run MSD Dist
with their box and a Blaster 2 coil since 1997 on both small and big
block chev and I have never had a problem. I thru the resister away
long ago..Did not know Msd made in Mexico, guess I should read more,
but then if it works for me, I'm happy.

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Originally Posted by rdobbs

Well, I am by far no expert on any of this, but I have run MSD Dist
with their box and a Blaster 2 coil since 1997 on both small and big
block chev and I have never had a problem. I thru the resister away
long ago..Did not know Msd made in Mexico, guess I should read more,
but then if it works for me, I'm happy.

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not sure on the box but the blaster coil is made in mexico

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Originally Posted by pat mccarthy

ok yep your the one that did say use a basllast on HEI or did i miss some thing ???? his old coil was for a points dist ?????not hei

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Yeah as it turns out the old coil was for a points type dist. Which I did not know at the time or until yesterday. Lack of information on package and no instructions. I might have said ballast on hei. Not for the hei, but rather for the coil that may have been designed for it. I think the coil mfg's may not have taken these type dist into account, as they are fairly new. Msd and others have electronic ignition systems with ext coils, but they have control box and their coils are designed for those products. HEI traditionally have the coil in the cap. Even the conversion to run ext coil with stock type HEI were more for using larger coils, that usually have cooling fins, not old style round can coils. And as I am finding out none of the mfg's that I have looked at specifically say that any of their round can coils are for HEI type system. My question was ballast to keep coil from going bad, not for HEI dist. And Mfg's recomendations are surly the way to go, but they probably didn't figure someone would want to use an old sytle coil on one of these dist. There are better coils, but they look like 2010 coils.

And I suppose I am the dumb a##, I never thought of points, I have been running HEI's since about 1977, its only now that I have used one with the external coil, (Size of dist), and wanting to look like an older setup. The thought never occured to me until coil was going out and I started thinking about it.

I believe I have it figured out. And thanks for all the input and recomendatios. There is no point beating a dead horse.

well i know i had a setup like yours? on my 50 many years ago stock GM HEI with a ex coil that was a jacobs kit and i used the box mallory hei coil. msd has nothing that will work in a round can coil?

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Originally Posted by pat mccarthy

not sure on the box but the blaster coil is made in mexico

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Yeah Pat, those must have been the "high quality" ones. :LOL: Today looked at MSD Blaster 2 coil, damn it, Made in CHINA. I guess they had to cut costs. I talked to MSD today, they say don't need no stinking ballast. But guess what that guy doesn't even know how they are wired, he says ballast only reduces voltage to points or trigger device, but if you look at a stock wiring diagram or the MSD instruction sheet, the ballast is inbetween the 12v wire comming from ign switch and the + term on coil, so the voltage is dropped to the coil. The coil is not operating on 12 volts. So I am not sure he knows what he is talking about.

So no point's........... screw the ballast..........if the coil burns out send it back to f.........ing CHINA. Now some engineer at MSD knows the true answer, but you don't talk to them, you talk to some smuck who answers your question off a list, if your question ain't on the list you get no answer. And my accel, CHINA, coil is 1.5 ohm, so according to accel's specs it needs no ballast resistor. Do you know any coil's made in USA? I should get off my soap box, but I get so irratated, these companies were founded by hot rodders, they knew the products and they were made for performance, now it's all about margin and outsourcing.............................

well you may need to go in the way back machine to 1979? i was sure that last msd coil was from mexco? if there all made in china then the stickers are made in the usa ?????

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Originally Posted by pat mccarthy

well you may need to go in the way back machine to 1979? i was sure that last msd coil was from mexco? if there all made in china then the stickers are made in the usa ?????

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It probably was Pat, they may have just recently gone to china, also possible they have more than one source. I just hate that label now. But funny you should say that about the sticker, I have installed stuff that said, (in small print) box made in USA or printed in USA, contents made in china. Can you say N.O.S.:D I quit buying rebuilt starters, they have turned into junk, so I go to junk yard and get one, of course pretty soon those will all be junk rebuilts in junk yard. Catch 22 I guess. Not picking on MSD or anyone else I have bought certain parts or items that were good in the past but now don't hold up or don't work at all, and some stuff doesn't have a country of orign, may say assembled in mexico, parts could come from china or bulgaria for all I know. I replaced a watervalve that didn't work properly from day 1 for a customer, we laughed because we thought we might have gotten a higher quality replacement part (made in Mexico):LOL:

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Originally Posted by pat mccarthy

well you may need to go in the way back machine to 1979? i was sure that last msd coil was from mexco? if there all made in china then the stickers are made in the usa ?????

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Oh just thought of somthing else, might try to scroung up some of those older parts, ya know like that MSD coil, even made in Mexico. It might not be that far into the future those items NOT made in CHINA will bring some good bucks on E-Bay................Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm :D