400 block

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11-02-2005, 01:36 PM
camaro_fever68

Quote:

Originally posted by 383 chev
L.O.L L.O.L L.O.L build the 400 no replacement for displacement steve morris racing built my engine when i called there to see if they had a 4 bolt block he said that they are weaker oh YEAH i run IT ON THE STREET with no steam holes every1 has an opinion call the pros!!!???

HOW DO YOU RUN A 400 ON THE STREET WITH NO STEAM HOLES. I KNOW THEY CAN DO IT ON THE TRACK BUT NEVER SEEN IT DONE ON THE STREET. WHAT DO YOU HAVE TO MODIFY FOR IT TO WORK. IS THERE ANOTHER WAY TO BLEED THE TRAPPED STEAM IN BETWEEN THE CYLINDERS?:confused:
11-02-2005, 05:43 PM
erik erikson

Quote:

Originally posted by camaro_fever68
HOW DO YOU RUN A 400 ON THE STREET WITH NO STEAM HOLES. I KNOW THEY CAN DO IT ON THE TRACK BUT NEVER SEEN IT DONE ON THE STREET. WHAT DO YOU HAVE TO MODIFY FOR IT TO WORK. IS THERE ANOTHER WAY TO BLEED THE TRAPPED STEAM IN BETWEEN THE CYLINDERS?:confused:

An Edelbrock water Bypass kit.
11-02-2005, 09:06 PM
camaro_fever68

Quote:

Originally posted by erik erikson
An Edelbrock water Bypass kit.

I can't find enough info to label that as a sure alternative to steam holes being drilled. I'm not saying that it won't work for some heads and engines, but I don't think it will work for most. It seems like a maybe so maybe not chance that you got to be willing to take. I do think that it most certainly could help an overheating engine. I can't really see the theory behind why it can replace steam holes. Take for instance, putting pipe plugs in the water holes and then having the block decked and drilling 3/16 holes in them works. That works because your using more water to cool the twin cylinders. Explain to me Erik or anybody else.

OOPS, I called them cylinders twin......I meant SIAMESE. Whew!
11-02-2005, 09:35 PM
erik erikson

Quote:

Originally posted by camaro_fever68
I can't find enough info to label that as a sure alternative to steam holes being drilled. I'm not saying that it won't work for some heads and engines, but I don't think it will work for most. It seems like a maybe so maybe not chance that you got to be willing to take. I do think that it most certainly could help an overheating engine. I can't really see the theory behind why it can replace steam holes. Take for instance, putting pipe plugs in the water holes and then having the block decked and drilling 3/16 holes in them works. That works because your using more water to cool the twin cylinders. Explain to me Erik or anybody else.

OOPS, I called them cylinders twin......I meant SIAMESE. Whew!

I am not saying it can or will replace the steam holes but it does provide a more direct shot of water and in a larger volume.I would think the water would absorb more of the heat than the steam would and would help get rid of the (hot spots).
11-02-2005, 11:08 PM
383 chev

Quote:

Originally posted by camaro_fever68
HOW DO YOU RUN A 400 ON THE STREET WITH NO STEAM HOLES. I KNOW THEY CAN DO IT ON THE TRACK BUT NEVER SEEN IT DONE ON THE STREET. WHAT DO YOU HAVE TO MODIFY FOR IT TO WORK. IS THERE ANOTHER WAY TO BLEED THE TRAPPED STEAM IN BETWEEN THE CYLINDERS?:confused:

ummm no!! in order for u to run with no steam holes it is recommeded that ur cruise speed be 3000rpm or more give steve morris a call see what he has to say he'll be glad to help
11-02-2005, 11:14 PM
383 chev

I ran mine all summer long with no steam holes in the bistering heat at the stop light omg omg omg its gonna blow. not really all i got to say is if u wanna 406 and u dont like the idea of no stem holes put them in they will. or go after market block they sell them all day long. erik u got a threefitty block i want 1 my 400 gonna blow tommorrow

KURPLUNKED
11-03-2005, 04:09 AM
erik erikson

Quote:

Originally posted by 383 chev
I ran mine all summer long with no steam holes in the bistering heat at the stop light omg omg omg its gonna blow. not really all i got to say is if u wanna 406 and u dont like the idea of no stem holes put them in they will. or go after market block they sell them all day long. erik u got a threefitty block i want 1 my 400 gonna blow tommorrow

KURPLUNKED

UMMM,why do you call yourself 383 Chev then??What is a threefitty block?
11-03-2005, 04:18 AM
erik erikson

Quote:

Originally posted by 383 chev
ummm no!! in order for u to run with no steam holes it is recommeded that ur cruise speed be 3000rpm or more give steve morris a call see what he has to say he'll be glad to help

Do you work for steve morris? You sure do put his name out there. I am sure he has his own opinons.
11-03-2005, 06:15 AM
camaro_fever68

Quote:

Originally posted by erik erikson
I am not saying it can or will replace the steam holes but it does provide a more direct shot of water and in a larger volume.I would think the water would absorb more of the heat than the steam would and would help get rid of the (hot spots).

To my knowledge (does not mean I think I am right) the problem doesn't come from water volume. I think that if you didn't have the holes between them cylinders the water would make a hot spot and turn to steam. It would trap the water and just keep heating it. The holes prevent steam because it lets the water flow. I could be wrong though......unsure....??
11-03-2005, 06:22 AM
camaro_fever68

Quote:

Originally posted by 383 chev
I ran mine all summer long with no steam holes in the bistering heat at the stop light omg omg omg its gonna blow. not really all i got to say is if u wanna 406 and u dont like the idea of no stem holes put them in they will. or go after market block they sell them all day long. erik u got a threefitty block i want 1 my 400 gonna blow tommorrow

KURPLUNKED

I guess if money was no object I'd have a couple of them 1750-2300 dollar blocks. Hell I'll even take donations from you.
11-03-2005, 12:39 PM
shevy not heme

I quit reading when 75TA said he was pulling a 383 to use a 421 and is overlooking the 377 build. OH MY GOD, I thought all these 'rock throwers' knew thats the only logical thing to do with a 400 block. Well,,,,,,,there is this road on Pikes peak that has a very narrow curve and I just think a 400 would look so lovely going,,," help I'm going to starve to death before I hit the bottom ".:LOL:
11-03-2005, 01:00 PM
camaro_fever68

Quote:

Originally posted by shevy not heme
I quit reading when 75TA said he was pulling a 383 to use a 421 and is overlooking the 377 build. OH MY GOD, I thought all these 'rock throwers' knew thats the only logical thing to do with a 400 block. Well,,,,,,,there is this road on Pikes peak that has a very narrow curve and I just think a 400 would look so lovely going,,," help I'm going to starve to death before I hit the bottom ".:LOL:

A 377 has no place in a street mobile. That engine don't make power till about 4000 rpm. Unless you want to run a big stall or a manual and a deep gear is a must. I like torque and long strokes equal long torque numbers. Cubes is where it at on the street.
11-03-2005, 08:49 PM
383 chev

Quote:

Originally posted by erik erikson
UMMM,why do you call yourself 383 Chev then??What is a threefitty block?

cause i had 1 and i cant change my name and i never thought i'd own a 406. 400 block if u will but u know now that i have ran 1 i will never go back ok. everthing i say is JIMHO. Steve Morris helped me with the combo and put the rotating assembly together degreed the cam and i did hte top end cause i just gotta have my hands in it. I am set in my ways u are set into yours and lets agree to disagree and no donations from me either. and my next motor will be a 406 and the 1 after and the 1 after that and the 1 after that and the 1 after that and the 1 after that:D
11-03-2005, 08:51 PM
383 chev

oh and i think u post just see how many u can get JIMHO
11-03-2005, 08:53 PM
erik erikson

Quote:

Originally posted by 383 chev
oh and i think u post just see how many u can get JIMHO

YOU KNOW WHAT THEY SAY ABOUT OPINIONS.L.O.L
11-03-2005, 08:55 PM
383 chev

yeah and ur is so great that u repied within seconds get `1
11-03-2005, 09:01 PM
erik erikson

Quote:

Originally posted by 383 chev
yeah and ur is so great that u repied within seconds get `1

UMMM,ACTUALLY IT WAS MINUTE'S.THERE ARE 60 SECOND'S IN ONE MINUTE.
11-03-2005, 11:31 PM
383 chev

120 seconds in 2 minutes
11-03-2005, 11:41 PM
FMXhellraiser

This thread has turned in to a fricking joke! :(
11-04-2005, 12:33 AM
76GMC1500

Quote:

Originally posted by erik erikson
Perhaps,they are just weak blocks.Hey why don't they build them any more?I can't even find them in the G.M catalog.I wonder why that is?Could it be G.M. also thinks they are junk?I build them the same way I build my 383's.I am getting about 40 nights on my 383's before I even touch them. If you will notice I am cracking the blocks.Well over 650 h.p. maybe in a drag car for 6 seconds in the 1/8 or maybe a 10 second 1/4 mile pass but never in a circle track car lap after lap.You might get 10 -20 nights out of one if you are very lucky.Better say you hail Mary's if you are really making these h.p. numbers.

Most of the Gen I small block blocks GM is producing nowadays are of a 400 bore (4.125" or greater), some do have 400 mains, and most have siamesed bores, just like the 400. Heck, even the new LS2 and LS7 motors have siamesed bores. There is nothing wrong with cylinders that touch.
11-04-2005, 12:46 AM
76GMC1500

Quote:

Originally posted by erik erikson
Why not try a 383? Same 3.75 stroke as the 400.

Bore is just as important to torque as stroke. Remember, it's the pressure in the cylinder that makes the power. Pressure is measured in lbs per square inch. A 350 block with a 4 inch bore has 12.57 square inches which means 1 psi of cylinder pressure will create 12.57 lbs of force downwards on the connecting rod. A 400 with a 4.125" bore makes 13.36 lbs force. Take the perpindicular to the crankshaft component of that downward force and multiply it by the effective length of the lever arm created by the stroke at that crankshaft position, and you've got yourself the torque produced by the engine. Obviously, both the size of the piston and the stroke contribute.
11-04-2005, 06:51 AM
erik erikson

Quote:

Originally posted by 76GMC1500
Bore is just as important to torque as stroke. Remember, it's the pressure in the cylinder that makes the power. Pressure is measured in lbs per square inch. A 350 block with a 4 inch bore has 12.57 square inches which means 1 psi of cylinder pressure will create 12.57 lbs of force downwards on the connecting rod. A 400 with a 4.125" bore makes 13.36 lbs force. Take the perpindicular to the crankshaft component of that downward force and multiply it by the effective length of the lever arm created by the stroke at that crankshaft position, and you've got yourself the torque produced by the engine. Obviously, both the size of the piston and the stroke contribute.

YES,THEY DO.DON'T FORGET THE SHORT 5.565 ROD IN IT. BUT TAKE A LOOK AT THE SMALL AMOUNT OF METAL BETWEEN EACH BORE ON A 400 CYLINDER THEN TAKE A LOOK AT THE METAL BETWEEN THE CYLINDERS ON THE 350 BLOCK.KEEP IN MIND THE SMALL AMOUNT OF METAL BETWEEN THE CYLINDERS ON THE 400 AND YOU HAVE TO SEAL IT UP WITH A GASKET.NOW HOW MUCH PRESSURE DO YOU WANT TO PUT ON THE CYLINDERS OF A 400 BLOCK?
11-04-2005, 07:07 AM
erik erikson

Quote:

Originally posted by 76GMC1500
Most of the Gen I small block blocks GM is producing nowadays are of a 400 bore (4.125" or greater), some do have 400 mains, and most have siamesed bores, just like the 400. Heck, even the new LS2 and LS7 motors have siamesed bores. There is nothing wrong with cylinders that touch.

BORE SIZE,MAIN SIZE AND SIAMESED CYLINDERS ARE NOT THE POINT.THE POINT IS THE OLD 400 BLOCKS USE LESS METAL IN CERTAIN PLACES.THE 400 WAS A CHEAPLY MADE ENGINE FOR CARS,AND TRUCKS AND WAS NEVER MADE FOR ANY TYPE OF PERFORMANCE APPLICTAION.IF IT WAS DON'T YOU THINK THE ENGINEER'S AT G.M. WOULD HAVE PUT A LONGER ROD THAN A 5.565 IN IT.HOW CAN YOU COMPARE A 30 YEAR OLD ENGINE WITH THE ENGINES OF TODAY?WHEN THESE ENGINES FIRST CAME OUT THEY DID'NT EVEN HAVE H.E.I. A LOT OF THINGS HAVE CHANGED IN 30 + YEARS.IT IS LIKE COMPARING (APPLES TO ORANGES).
11-04-2005, 09:01 AM
shevy not heme

No eric,that would be 'apples to lemons'. :rolleyes: Who said you can't run a 377 on the street?
11-04-2005, 11:14 AM
76GMC1500

GM didn't change the distance between bore centerlines on the new 400's which can be bored to 4.190". That means even less area between the cylinders. Obviously, this isn't a problem.
11-04-2005, 04:11 PM
camaro_fever68

Quote:

Originally posted by erik erikson
YES,THEY DO.DON'T FORGET THE SHORT 5.565 ROD IN IT. BUT TAKE A LOOK AT THE SMALL AMOUNT OF METAL BETWEEN EACH BORE ON A 400 CYLINDER THEN TAKE A LOOK AT THE METAL BETWEEN THE CYLINDERS ON THE 350 BLOCK.KEEP IN MIND THE SMALL AMOUNT OF METAL BETWEEN THE CYLINDERS ON THE 400 AND YOU HAVE TO SEAL IT UP WITH A GASKET.NOW HOW MUCH PRESSURE DO YOU WANT TO PUT ON THE CYLINDERS OF A 400 BLOCK?

THERE IS NO DOUBT GM *#@#$! UP ROD SIZE IN THE 400 BLOCK. BIG DEAL THROW EM AWAY JUST LIKE THE HEADS AND THE CAST PISTONS. ENGINE BUILDING AND MODIFYING ISN'T LIMITED TO WHERE RODS CAN'T BE CHANGED. I HAVE A 509 400 BLOCK WITH A 3.875 STROKE AND 6.0 RODS. FELPRO MAKES GREAT HEAD GASKETS THAT SEAL THAT SMALL AMOUNT OF METAL WITH NO PROBLEM.**)
11-04-2005, 04:20 PM
camaro_fever68

Quote:

Originally posted by shevy not heme
No eric,that would be 'apples to lemons'. :rolleyes: Who said you can't run a 377 on the street?

\

I DIDN'T SAY YOU CAN'T RUN IT, YOU CAN DO WHAT YOU WANT.
HELL YOU CAN RUN A TOP FUEL DRAG ENGINE ON THE STREET FOR A LIL WHILE. (3MIN) AS FOR 377, ITS NOT A TORQUE ENGINE. IT MAKES HP HIGH IN THE RPM RANGE. UNLESS YOU GOT A DEEP GEAR, MANUAL/HIGH STALL, AND LIGHT VEHICLE, A STOUT 383 WILL SPANK THAT @#@.
11-04-2005, 06:40 PM
erik erikson

Quote:

Originally posted by shevy not heme
No eric,that would be 'apples to lemons'. :rolleyes: Who said you can't run a 377 on the street?

YOU CAN IF YOU WANT JUST USE A 4.88 GEAR AND A 4,500 STALL YOU WILL BE FINE.
11-04-2005, 06:52 PM
erik erikson

Quote:

Originally posted by 76GMC1500
GM didn't change the distance between bore centerlines on the new 400's which can be bored to 4.190". That means even less area between the cylinders. Obviously, this isn't a problem.

HOW CAN YOU COMPARE AN ALUMINUM BLOCK WITH CAST IRON SLEEVES TO A CAST IRON BLOCK?WOW!! THIS IS REALLY A STRETCH.IT IS ABOUT LIKE COMPARING MY DART BLOCK WITH ONE OF MY OLD 283 BLOCKS.AT LEAST THEY ARE BOTH CAST IRON.L.O.L
11-07-2005, 06:30 PM
Sleeper959

Mouse motors

Hello, folks! I discovered your fine forum while researching what I should ask for my 400 engine, and I liked it so much I joined! Looks like $300 is about top dollar for this rebuildable bad boy around here (complete motor, stock heads and intake, all the tin, still ran great). Any other opinions? It was still running strong when I retired it after 12 years - still blows the tires, ran a 10.0 1/8th. Would have run in the 9's or 8's if it would hook. But has a noisy lifter now (probably worn out cam - TRW with a bit of lift) and burns a little oil. Valve guide seals have been leaking for some time - I expect there will be a good deal of carbon in there, also from the aging Q-jet). A couple of my buddies built the motor for me many years ago!
11-07-2005, 06:33 PM
Sleeper959

(Part Two)

Without trying to get into the running argument, I did crack a head a few years ago, and the 400s have just seemed a little hot-running to me (I did put a 4-flu radiator in it, and the 350 heads did have steam holes) and it never liked anything below 92 octane. So I retired it this month in favor of an HT 383 crate motor, which actually makes the ol' 400 look sick. Of course, the Vortec heads and higher intake may have something to do with it! (435 ft-lbs and 340 hp) But I'm just less nervous about it now, and it runs great on 89 octane. I could run 87, but that stuff stinks when it burns.

So, should I hold out for more for the 400? Maybe hang onto it and rebuild it at my leisure with real stuff? It's not eating anything in the garage, and they just aren't growing any more of them... But it would be nice to recoup some of the dough I laid out for that 383!
11-07-2005, 06:58 PM
dcoffield

IMHO price really depends on the part of the country you are in. Near motown here motors seem to be relatively cheap. I recently picked up 2 400's for around 175 each. In other areas i know they go for quite a bit more. Of course around here the motor is the only thing left after the rust gets done the car.
11-07-2005, 07:05 PM
Bryan TTM

i didnt even read all the posts on this one...i ran 400 blocks with a 600 hp shot of juice...they never lasted long...BUT once i bought the DART Iron Eagle block...all the cylinder walkin, steam hole burnin gaskets, deck distortin went away :cool:

DART ROCKS :3dSMILE:
11-07-2005, 07:57 PM
Sleeper959

Thanks, DC! Glad to know you can still find your favorite flavor of mouse motor around Detroit, at least!

Oh, this sleeper is an everyday driver. Just something to get you out of a jam.
11-07-2005, 08:10 PM
dcoffield

There seems to be deals-o-plenty around here. That's why I have 6 blocks setting around (I got a little carried away). Bought a Th350 trans, the guy throws in a 350 engine for an extra 50 bucks. Bought another 350 4 bolt 010 for $105, he includes a set of new TRW pistons that I turn around and sell for $109. I love ebay (no I don't have an ebay problem, really :HMMM: ).

I would think you could get decent $ for it around Birmingham as long as it's Birmingham Alabama and not Birmingham Michigan.

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