You know that sound???

That little squeiching noise that you hear just before you snap off a TAP! :whacked: Yea, it happened today:CRY::CRY:

While putting a March accessory drive on my engine today I snapped a 3/8" tap off in the head. OOOOOHHHHH SH********T!!!!!:whacked::whacked::whacked:

Worked at it a bit with a small, 3/16", carbide bur enough to get the ends cleaned up. There was a small piece sticking out so I tried the welding a 3/8 nut to it trick. No dice, it snapped right off. Now it's below the surface!:CRY::CRY::CRY:

Hustled down to the guy that sharpens my blades who also sells tools. Asked for whatever broken tap extraction tools he had. He had some smaller carbide burs in case I had to cut it out. He also had a Walton Tap Extractor. Back at the shop I cleaned up the end of the tap so I could identify each of the 4 flutes in the tap.

Positioned the Walton tool into the broken tap and tapped the pins into place. Got my torch out and slowly heated the head around the hole. At first it did nothing. I sprayed some Blaster in and waited a while. Heated the head again and slowly, it began to back out.

All in all it took about an hour. BOY WAS I HAPPY!!!:rolleyes::rolleyes::D:D

starred in that movie . glad you got it out .

One of the saddest sounds known to man..... Been there, done that, and it didn't always end nice.

Yeah, it had all the markings of a really bad day. I've never used one of the Walton tools before, and I was really skeptical but it worked great!

were you chasing threads or making threads ?

I was wondering what that sound of rushing air was!!
Musta been when it broke, because it sounded like a vacuum!! ;-) Ya know, that other sound, the giant breath you take so you can say every #&$%@&#@ word under the sun.....

Glad it worked out for ya!!

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Originally Posted by HOSS429

were you chasing threads or making threads ?

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I was chasing threads. All I had was a 3/8 taper tap. Now I've got a bottom and taper. The head was aluminum and till I started backing the tap out, it gave no warning. If you don't have one of these Walton tools in ur tool box, get one!

It take a different bit to clean up threads, taps are for cutting not cleaning. Here is the bit for chasing the threads. I know it is to late for future reference it is a good thing to know.

ARP 911-0002, ARP Thread Cleaning Chasers | ARP
"Note: These are strictly cleaning taps and are NOT designed to cut thread."

Glad all turned out well and lucky it broke off close to the surface...

Aluminum is particularly unforgiving to chasing threads with a cutting tap.

If memory serves, a two flute tap is more forgiving. I've never had a tap bind up just chasing threads. Were you using lube? Tap magic is my favorite.

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Originally Posted by firebird77clone

Aluminum is particularly unforgiving to chasing threads with a cutting tap.

If memory serves, a two flute tap is more forgiving. I've never had a tap bind up just chasing threads. Were you using lube? Tap magic is my favorite.

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As a matter of fact, I was using Tap Magic. I've never had a problem using bottom taps to clean up threads.

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Originally Posted by pepi

It take a different bit to clean up threads, taps are for cutting not cleaning. Here is the bit for chasing the threads. I know it is to late for future reference it is a good thing to know.

ARP 911-0002, ARP Thread Cleaning Chasers | ARP
"Note: These are strictly cleaning taps and are NOT designed to cut thread."

Glad all turned out well and lucky it broke off close to the surface...

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OK--I got hammered on another site about using a TAP as opposed to a THREAD CHASER. I have heard the term THREAD CHASER" but never seen a tap labeled as such. Therefore, I consulted with a friend of mine that is a retired machinist for NASA (now is a consultant/trainer for large industrial machine Co.) and over the course of an afternoon got a, hands on, education on taps and dies.

In the world of machinist, where taps and dies are a daily tool, THREAD CHASERS are a joke. What I mean is this. There are no "quality manufactures", Morse, Greenfield, Yamawa, Emuge or OSG that make anything called a thread chaser or cleaner. The ones from APR are cheap taps, not HSS, same as you would buy from HF. The ONLY advantage in using a tap such as this is if it does break you can drill it out as they are NOT HSS (high speed steel) These are the taps that I, normally, use to clean up threads because they are CHEAP, meaning they are not as aggressive as quality HSS taps.

There are other types of taps called roll taps or forming taps. These taps, which can't be used in every metal type, actually FORMS the threads in the metal as opposed to cutting them.

So, don't be fooled by deceptive advertising. If you want taps to CLEAN up a thread, buy a set of HF.

Interesting discussion... I've always just used cutting taps for chasing threads too :confused:

Anybody ever taken the time to look and measure a "chasing" tap vs. a "cutting" tap? I'd assume the chasing taps are merely a bit undersize?
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Originally Posted by lakeroadster

Interesting discussion... I've always just used cutting taps for chasing threads too :confused:

Anybody ever taken the time to look and measure a "chasing" tap vs. a "cutting" tap? I'd assume the chasing taps are merely a bit undersize?
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Actually John, tools marketed and sold as "thread chasers" ARE JUST REGULAR TAPS. Most, if not all, are cheap, normal carbon steel and most with only 2 flutes. In fact, the only advantage to using a carbon steel tap is if it does break it is much easier to drill out.

Nobody makes an "undersized" tap to use as a thread chaser. This machinist friend of mine actually had a tool that he made to chase threads in a project that he worked on. It was no more than a hardened steel bolt that had a sharp troth cut into the length of the threads.

If you want to clean up your threads, lube your tap well and slowly run it in. A 3/8 tap WON'T cut new threads unless you cross thread it in. It will cut 3/8" threads just like new.

I'll toss in my 2 pennies.. in my experiences thread chasers are a waste.

The aluminum head probably galled and welded to the tap, always apply a lubricant and not "Tap Free", especially when working with Aluminum and Stainless Steel.

"Tap Free for ferrous metals", and "Tap Free for Aluminum" work well when cutting threads. for chasing threads, I just use wheel bearing grease 'cause the junk clings to the grease and helps clean the bore, just blast with air after and the junk and grease all come out. I've been known to use my old 9 volt makita cordless drill, set the clutch to minimum and using low range have at it. Skill or luck..??..? who cares! I haven't broken a tap in years.

For all stainless fasteners and aluminum parts make sure to use an anti sieze, if you don't have an anti sieze or any lube, you can actually use toothpaste, while I've never tried it.. it supposedly works well.

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Originally Posted by TerpnGator

Actually John, tools marketed and sold as "thread chasers" ARE JUST REGULAR TAPS. Most, if not all, are cheap, normal carbon steel and most with only 2 flutes. In fact, the only advantage to using a carbon steel tap is if it does break it is much easier to drill out.

Nobody makes an "undersized" tap to use as a thread chaser. This machinist friend of mine actually had a tool that he made to chase threads in a project that he worked on. It was no more than a hardened steel bolt that had a sharp troth cut into the length of the threads.

If you want to clean up your threads, lube your tap well and slowly run it in. A 3/8 tap WON'T cut new threads unless you cross thread it in. It will cut 3/8" threads just like new.

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I emailed a friend who has been a machinist most of his life. His comment was:

"Interesting. I had never heard of a tap called a thread chaser. Used what was available starting-bottoming. I have also taken a bolt and ground a slot with a slight "cutting" edge to clean the threads."

Well, I ain't no kind of machinist, although I have machined a bit of stuff in my time, and I ain't much of a mechanic, although I have been wrenching on some thing or another most of my years; I have always used what I had on hand, and found that ideally, a tap with larger flutes, eg: a two or three flute vs. a four flute worked a bit better because it carried the "schmutz" out of the threads a bit better - more space for it in the tap, easier to flush out with a blast of air or pressurized lubricant. Also, a bottoming tap is nice; but, I have sometimes done the grooving thing on a bolt like John says, and for cleaning out, that works pretty well. In my experience, a thinner lubricant also seems to work better than a heavy type for cleaning out, especially blind holes. Of course, when you have to keep tight control of chips and other "schmutz", like spark plug holes, grease is the best lube, and an easy, light touch on the tap wrench.

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