Printable View
Hi, new to the forum. I've purchased a 41 ford coupe. Needs a lot of sheet metal work, also want to upgrade drive train. Any suggestions or ideas of where to Purchase replacement parts would be appreciated. Also what's involved in SBC & Auto trans install
Thanks
Tim
Welcome to the forum. The '41 sounds like it will be a good build. Why not go Ford in Ford, either a 5.0/AOD or even a 4.6 Mod Motor? Keeping it all Ford is a plus in my book.
Welcome aboard! Good to have you here.
I envy you owning a real steel '41. Check Hemmings Motor News for Carpenter ads to get replacement sheet metal. Rodger and others have been successful with Ford-in-Ford but I gave up way back when I studied some old articles by the late Frank Oddo in Street Rodder. The problem has to do with splitting the wishbone and fitting in the longer water pump. The tradeoff in my mind is that Ford has the distributor in the front but needs a short water pump while the alternate SBC is easier to fit in but has the distributor in a tight spot in the rear. In general there seem to be more aftermarket pieces for the SBC and probably the SBC conversion is cheaper if that matters to you. If the flathead is not cracked you could look around for a 4" stroker crank but I would not bore it out more than the minimum for a rebuild since the 3 5/16" and 3 3/8" bores may lead you to overheating. Any of the three options will require a better radiator. The SBF is lighter than the SBC which is worth considering. The problem with a flathead is that unless you have a good block without any cracks the cost of a replacement block with be three or four times the cost of a SBC or SBF. Anyway it is the smooth body that is so neat. the original buggy spring suspension can be used with simple longer shackles on the original buggy cross springs to avoid (at least temporarily) further suspension mods. Well good luck and do whatever pleases you but I would just lower the body and keep it smooth but do whatever you want. The folks here like lots of pictures so send us some as work progresses. I can vouch that there is a LOT of good friendly expertise on this Forum so don't hesitate to ask questions. As I said I would really enjoy building a '41 coupe because many of my H.S. buddies had that model.
Don Shillady
Retired Scientist/teen rodder
Dennis Carpenter Best place I know to start
You can make the 5.0/302 SBF shorter almost the same way you make an SBC shorter here is how and the proof is in pictures,scroll down to post# 5 sbf/short water pump/pulleys - THE H.A.M.B. Also advantages with a SBF: 80 lbs lighter than the SBC,2 1/2" narrower for better header to steering box clearance and the front mounted distributor provides better firewall clearance.
You may also want to stop by here:Butch's Cool Stuff41/48 Ford car Bolt-In SB Ford Eng Mount kit CP2202 $99 transmission mount also available must specify which one,not a bad idea to call for advice too,nice folks.
...and you'll be surprised how many comments you get from people when they see that you've invested the time & effort to keep it Ford powered. I can't tell you how many times I've heard, "Well I'm glad to see you made it Ford in Ford." Lots of people will give you their list of reasons for going SBC instead, but seeing an old Olds with a 4-4-2 engine, a Pontiac with a GTO Tri-Power, or a Buick with a Nailhead is just RIGHT. The other thing you'll hear is "...glad it's not another 350/350." There's easy and there's unique, and you're at the fork in the road ;):LOL: . Of course I still want a classic old Chevy with a big ol' Ford engine in it just for some "payback".:D:D:DQuote:
Originally Posted by Jeff B
Welcome to the forum, '41 Ford is a sweetie. I am a traditionalist and there is just one engine to put in that car...a flattie merc (a 312 Y block would be acceptable). As far as parts go i'd be talking to Dick Spadaro; Bob Drake (if they went out of business thier website would redirect you to whomever bought the inventory and patterns etc); Joblot Automotive has a good inventory of nos stuff too. The commercial people like Macs; LMC; Dennis Carpenter will sell you the finest in reproduced parts that may or maynot work as intended.
Search ebay and start purchasing every piece of NOS stuff you can find. I might have your heater/defroster switch panel if you need one.
Back to the engine, there is nothing like the sound of a hot rod 40 coupe - it is legendary. And that sound comes from a stroker merc flattie, a close second is the Y block. Got to have a manual transmission. Either engine will idle about 450 rpm and sound just like a chriscraft idling at the docks. That is priceless.
Hi, years ago I put a 428 Ford big block with C-6 transmission in a 47 (same frame and size as yours). I really did not have any major problems with the install so SBC being so much smaller in every dimension and lighter, it should be a snap. Simple to make you own motor mounts and transmission mounts.
In the light of "To each his own" if I were building a new 41, I would chose a 98 Lincolin Mark VIII 32 V V-8 with its transmission. Sweet ride with lots of power and easy to get more power. But you are not building that car for me or anyone else here who gives you advice, so have fun picking out what you want.
Welcome Tporter to CHR!
You have not shared your proposed budget with us but all here know how that works, i.e., it always ends up more than you think it will in terms of dollars and sweat equity. I really like to looks of the old fords and the 41 is a keeper. If your budget allows and you're up for the long haul, I'd really consider the 5.0 Coyote engine with a six-speed OD transmission. 412 horsepower and the ultimate Ford engine in terms of technology and reliability. They've been out since later 2010 (in the Mustang GTs) and should start to show up wrecking yards.
Just my 2 cents.
Glenn
It all depends on the style you are going for. IMO, you need to settle on the finished look and build the car using it as a model. Do you want to make it a retro-60's look? Modern smoothie with billet and no door handles? Lowered 50's custom with fender skirts? There are so many choices, and each will help dictate the type of power you use. I would do a search for '41 Ford builds and determine what you like and go from there. We will be more than happy to provide our own two cents worth!
Princeton N.J. or Princeton W.Va.? Anyway, last winter I was strapped for cash and a sudden plumbing bill cropped up so I sold my stash of flathead parts to a nearby shop.
Joe Smith's Early V8 and Hot Rod which is very close to my home in Glen Allen Va. I sold a good 4" Merc crank, eight good rods, a flywheel with clutch pressure plate and three flathead blocks which all had cracks of one type or another. The guys from Joes gave me $250 for the lot and said the blocks could be repaired in one way or another. Since I am now committed to a SBC 350 I let the parts go for far less than new parts from Speedway. By the way Speedway does have most of parts needed to soup up a flathead but I would repeat my warning to not overbore a flathead block. Anyway, here is the address and phone number for their shop. For me their shop is a time warp into the 1950s with racks of smaller parts and several good blocks lined up on the floor. in the back they are building a '32 coupe and did have a suoped up 1950 Merc with a 4-speed for sale but it may have sold by now. Their shop moved here from Ga. after I was well into my SBC roadster but if they were here earlier I would have gone with a mild flattie. Even so the next step is to worry over the weak three speed trans and there are auto-trans conversions for the flathead.
Joes V8 Hot Rod Parts
8405 Cleveland St
Richmond, VA
23228
Phone: 804-264-1953
Fax: 804-264-5004
Don Shillady
Retired Scientist/teen rodder
Tim,
If you decide to look into a flathead do yourself a favor and give the guys at H&H Flatheads a call. They are the go-to guys who've been doing flatheads forever, know all the old school lessons, and know how to apply them to give you a reliable flatty engine in whatever configuration you want - HNH Flatheads: Ford Flathead rebuilding specialist Flatheads are super cool, but when you look at the $/HP be ready for sticker shock, especially if you start pushing the power envelope.
Well, since somebody - a good looking guy i'll add - brought up flatties and another mentioned Joe's in Richmond i believe they may have a french flattie block or two laying around.
This has to be a pretty rare vehicle, keeping it stock might be the idea ...
Back in the day I had a forty two door sedan, I picked up a built 296 flathead with tri-power, it was really fast out of the hole & I beat everybody around town, as to the transmission (39 box) they only lasted about a month before the syncro's gave up, the good thing was there were a lot of them laying around in the junk yards (early sixties).
Thanks to all that replied, A little more info about this particular 41. It was last licensed in 1956, then it seems someone attempted to install an olds 303 and auto trans along with an olds rearend. They didn't get it finished. Is there any point in finishing it that way.
Thanks again
Tim
Princeton, Minnesota
It would make a nice "period build" if you finished the install of the Olds running gear, but it all depends on what you're wanting to end up with. If it were mine I would be looking for a wrecked Mustang, T-bird or something else with a 4.6 mod motor, or even better if you could by chance find something wrecked with a 5.0 Coyote & tranny. Get the whole vehicle if you can, but if not get the driveline, wiring & computer. But then I'm repeating myself..... The most important part of the build is NOW, when you develop your detailed plan for where you want it to be, and how you're going to get there. The sure way to bust your budget is to deviate from the plan, and that's the voice of experience, big time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tporter
There are many questions here. Mainly, how much money you have/want to spend. I will admit I have been financially limited most of my life up till retirement so that I look at this in economical terms. I can recall the mystique around the 1950 stick shift Olds due to the Caddy transmission. Later Olds 3 speeds were not as good but that 1950 Olds stick shift was a Holy Grail among my high school and even college buddies back in the mid 1950s. Note the early 303 Rocket engine was rated at only 135 HP but had excellent low rpm torque. To those accustomed to what to expect on the street compared to a flathead Ford with dual carbs and high compression heads it was a rude awakening to match up with an early Rocket; especially since the Olds bodies looked heavier. Hudson Hornets were also fast street machines and all that Ford had to offer was the 4" stroke Mercury, never mind a mildly souped up 59AB flathead Ford. It may seem that only 35 more H.P. in the Rocket engine would not inspire such awe on the street but the other cars were so slow by comparison (even the beautiful Fischer body 1940 Chevy had a horrible vacuum shift on the OHV six). Soooo what to do in your case?
Look up Olds FAQ -- 303 CID Engine Detail
to decide if you want to keep what you have or upgrade it. The main reason your car was stuck in unfinished form was probably due to the infamous problem with the Olds engine having the starter on the left side and interfering with the Ford steering box. I may be wrong but I seem to remember the left side starter was a real problem and that is why the more recent SBC adapts OK with the right side starter. Maybe modern mini-starters are small enough to remove the interference. Taking the poor boy path, see if you can solve this starter problem with a modern mini-starter, shave the 303 heads to raise compression and get a four barrel intake with an Edelbrock 600 cfm carb and then address the sheet metal and paint the car! Considering that some SBC owners go to the trouble to adapt Rocket valve covers to later SBC engines you would have an interesting car.
On the other hand if you go the other route to adapting a more modern engine with electronic controls you could achieve better mpg but it may be a challenge to adapt the new wiring. So there is no easy answer. I think the options are:
1. Make the present set up work, perhaps solving the left-starter problem, raise compression, add a four barrel carb set up and end up with a "Sunday Car" with relatively low mpg but lots of nostalgia in what is mainly a show car.
2. Go for a modern adaptation, but not bleeding edge technology. On another thread Jerry Clayton noted that the '92-'97 LT1 SBC might be readily available from several GM models with relatively simple electronics and EFI which leads to better mpg.
3. Find an early SBC and install it with a mid-80s 700R4 so you can take advantage of all the SBC aftermarket parts. That provides an OD and has a right side starter. The front pully situation is easier to solve than for Ford and the metal firewall can be dented if the distributor needs clearance.
In any case I would keep the Oldsmobile rear if the tires fit under the fenders since that rear was stronger than the Ford banjo rear. I am guessing your 1956 conversion ran into the problem with the left side starter and if you can solve that just shave the heads and add a four barrel intake and then focus on the body work. Sorry about the long post but this takes me way back. I recall an early 1940 Plymouth with a Olds 303 but the steering on the Plymouth was different from the Ford of those years. In any event send some pictures to this Forum!
Don Shillady
Retired Scientist/teen rodder
Ford in Fords! Like it when I see em! What I really want to see is Fords in Chevy's!
Joking aside looking forward to watching your project here. What ever powertrain you decide to put in it, is your choice and not ours. SBF 5.0ltr. is an amazing engine especially with today"s technology. But it's hard to drift away from the SBC for parts availability for aftermarket stuff. It seems to get better every year for FORDS, but still your choices are more limited unless you can fabricate what you need.
Hello Tim. Just purchased a 41 Long door coupe in Dec 2013 myself. I am in the same spot as you. What direction to go...newer frame? engine? Tranny? rearend?...Lots of options...Drop me a line and a few Pics and we can compare notes. Good luck with your build. Paulo
Tim , I have a 41 ford two door with a flathead and I wished I had put a small block in it. I know a Chevy is cheaper and I like Chevy, but a Ford for a Ford it just sounds better. you have to think about a rear end so you can match up to newer trany. I used a S10 with the leaf springs this also help the wave action in the corners.
Hello Hot Rodders. I am also new to this club and also just purchased a 41 coupe in what sounds like the same condition. I have located a 41 frame( the original has rotted out and was replaced with a 80's chev frame) from another HotRodder up my way because I would like to keep it all Ford. I have an 87 Mustang donor with a 5.0 T5 with goodies that I plan on using for the build. I will be following Tim's build to get as much help as I can. I appreciate all input ideas offered.
Paulo,Quote:
Originally Posted by 41Woody
Welcome to CHR. If you're looking for input, and as a courtesy to Tim you really should start your own thread as opposed to jumping into an existing discussion. Just click the "Forums" tab above, select the section where you want to put your thread and once there click the "New Thread" button at the top.
The 41 is a great car. When I did mine I stayed with the flathead ,but often wish I used a small block. Over heating is the biggest problem.
It's nice to see more of these popping up as well as new members. :LOL: