is there any real differances in harmonic balancers

[daveid]

Im affriad I made my bolt holes too big on my balancer so im thinking Ill need to buy a new one. I "think" my engine is internally balanced but ill double check when the balancer comes off.
My engine is a 454 with a stock crank and about 450 hp. It only goes up to about 6000 rpms so would a oem balancer work just fine? Also, i keep seeing in summit and stuff, Big block balancers and then it says 396 and 427 and then the 454's have their own. Does that mean the 427's wont work for my engine?

thanx
david

[pat mccarthy]

366/396/402/427internal balance from gm all 454 are external balance so you need one for a 454 the race stuff alot of times go internal but you can not just throw a internal bal on it and call it good takes heavy metal in the crank or a after market crank made for a internal bal you can use a stock type will work but you may what a SFI secifications and there are good bal like power force+plus power bond . better ati tci fluidampr any one of them would work to but are a bit more money i like the ati.

[daveid]

i want a good one, but i dont want to buy a super one that i dont need if i dont have to have it, if you know what i mean. Plus im pissed at myself for screwing up my original balancer so its even harder to spend the money.

thanx
david

[daveid]

honestly, i had never heard of those and didnt know what they were. Now that i know what they are I will try them. Thanks a lot for telling me that. I know you told me that on my other thread but i was lost as to what they were. Do they sell them at any hardware store?

Thanx guys,
david

[Itoldyouso]

Usually places like Napa.


Here, maybe this will help you out....................



How to use a Helicoil
Posted on Thursday, March 18 @ 12:40:14 EST by Roadstarmagazine

Cool Tips! Helicoil KitEveryone has had it, that heart stopping moment when you think you have stripped out a thread and your wondering to yourself, "What the hell do I do now?" For me it was the thread on the sub-frame for one of the four bolts that hold the rear fender in place, I stripped that puppy good. Because of this I was looking down the barrel of well over a $100 for a second hand sub-frame or who knows how much for a new one! But thankfully that was when I remembered hearing about helicoil kits. Read on, if you will, as it might just save you a LOT of money someday and no end of anguish.

Experienced wrenches and even some home tinkerers will be familiar with helicoils, and if you are then you have probably had to use them in the application they were design for, which is creating a new thread for your bolts to grip onto. If you haven't heard of them then this article attempts to show you how easy they are to use and how they can save you a lot of money. To give you the short version, a helicoil kit will allow you to drill out a stripped bolt hole, tap a new thread into the larger hole, where you then wind in the helicoil, that in turn becomes the new "thread" for your bolts. Helicoils are also typically stronger than the metal you are putting them into, so chances of stripping out the thread again are just about zilch.

Basically a helicoil kit usually consists of a number of helicoils (duh), thread tapper and a couple of tools to put the kit in. Sometimes they will include the drill bit that you need, but you may have to buy it separately. If you do have to buy the drill bit separately make sure you buy EXACTLY the size that your kit requires, one measurement too big or too small and it is useless. Oh and be sure to buy a drill bit that is for drilling metal, don't try and save money on a wood drill bit, it just isn't worth it.

Now I'd had problems in the past when a misaligned bolt stripped some of the thread of my fender sub-frame (because I like to swap between solo and two-up a lot) although I was able to save it at the time just by re-tapping the hole. It was when I was putting on a new set of saddle bags that I stripped out the hole completely and the weight of the bags (Tour Classics) meant I had to fix the problem without delay. For the record, the size helicoil kit I used was M8-1.25 (matches the bolt type for that area) and the drill to match this kit is a 21/64 hi speed bit. If the drill bit isn't included in the kit and the size required isn't written anywhere then ASK which one you need, don't ASSUME!

Helicoil KitSo the first thing you have to do is to drill out the hole, just make sure you have the drill as straight as possible. The drill bit for my kit was 21/64 in size so it left me with a perfectly flush hole with no sign of the old thread. Thankfully I was able to leave my fender in place for the job as it meant less stuffing around.

Helicoil KitNext you have to tap a new thread using the tap that comes with the kit. The tap is tapered at the front end to help you get the thread started and using a shifter you wind it through the hole. Make sure you wind it all the way through until you stop feeling "resistance" as this means the hole is now completely tapped with the new thread. Gently wind out the tap with the shifter and when you do you shouldn't feel any resistance, in fact you may even be able to twist it out with your fingers.

Now you get one of the helicoils and using the tool supplied you wind it into the new thread until it is flush with the frame (sorry no picture). You also shouldn't feel any resistance as you do this but if you do you may just need to clean the thread up a little. It is also at this point why the drill bit size is so important, as the outer thread of the helicoil will match the newly tapped hole, the inner thread of the helicoil will match your bolt size.

Helicoil KitOne the coil is in place you use the little punch that should come with the kit to knock the little tang off the end of the helicoil that assisted with winding it in. Don't try to twist this off (unless the instructions say to) as you may warp the helicoil and you don't want to do that.

And now your finished so all that is left is to put the bike back together! Because it was so simple I decided to drill out the other three holes in my sub-frame and put helicoils in all of them. As mentioned earlier the helicoils are usually a lot stronger than the metal they are put into so hopefully I am going to avoid the problem happening again down the road.

Hopefully this write-up will make you more confident in using a helicoil kit if you are ever unfortunate enough to need to utilise one.




Don

[pat mccarthy]

why dont you look at what i posted on the type of thread inserts? heli-coils they may work if you drill it over size and tap it .the tap may not work for the heli-coil if the holes is now to big that is why i told you to look at threaded inserts?you can get them in thin wall to i do not know how big you drill and tap it for but the thread inserts is a good fix and so are heli-coil have used both many times

[daveid]

THANK YOU GUYS!!! I REALLY APPRECIATE IT!
I am a brand new newb to this so i never had to retap or do anything like this so that why i am so stupid seeming right now.

Thanx again
david

[firebird77clone]

Another thing to know about helicoil type insterts: they come in various lenthts. The standard length will work for a shllow hole, but if you have a very deep hole, you need a longer length instert. The longer length inserts also will work for a shallow hole, you just wind it in as far as you need it, then grind off the part that sticks out. Then wind it in just a tad further to put the thread just past flush, and knock off the tang.

My philosophy on easy outs is this: they are NOT indestructibe! When you know you have a thread repair in a hole, ALWAYS thread the bolt in carefully. If you bugger it up, sometimes you can just reach in with a pair of needle nose pliers and pull it out. They will also drill out and you can go to a different type of thread insert which requires a larger hole, or go to a larger size bolt. Problem is, after you have drilled for the helicoil, you are usually past the hole size for the next oversize bolt.

Remember there are alternatives to heli coils: oversize bolts, thru-bolts ( nut on the back ) and other types of thread inserts.

good luck.

[Irelands child]

If this is an 'old' engine, I would replace the damper. There is a fair chance that the outer rim has (or will) move in relationship to the hub due to deterioration of the elastomer material between the two pieces. This movement will cause you to never be able to time the ignition properly. The fact that you stripped out the holes, IMHO, just makes this decision easier. There are several sources to purchase replacement from, Summit and Jeg's to an outfit called Damper Dudes and even more. When (IF?)you purchase a new one, I do suggest that you go a few more bucks for an SFI approved non-explodable damper.

If this is a fairly new damper, a Helicoil repair should work fine.

Another thing to check - did you score the crankshaft when you pulled the damper off? Or is it scored from just seal to crank wear? If so, you will need a repair sleeve for a proper seal to the crankshaft.

And you thought it was easy???