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Ok, I'm thinking something totally different but I'm curious...I've heard of the mid/late 90's model 'maro running consistant 11's and still being daily drivers...as in the owner drives it to the track, races it, and then drives it home...
Possible? If so, how hard is it to do this? What all does it take? Anyone know?
Go here, there are a fair number of folks that claim just what you said, I believe at least some of them:
http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=87/
Pat
What i was thinking about was this: Carry out my plan to make my truck right so that i have something to haul a trailer around with...then with the help of CHR and the chassis books that tech has told me about, build a full tube chassis, put a 4th gen body on it, and drag around like that.... to actually make it LS1 powered, id have to be very well financially. But carburated engine with an msd standalone ignition system, a powerglide, a sheet metal interior, i think it could work, plus id have a nice looking body that is very light...What is the estimated weight for a full tube chassis? I would estimate about 500 lbs of body metal, and then calculate engine/trans weight, Think i could get away with it weight about 2200 lbs? or at least in that range?
"Ok, I'm thinking something totally different but I'm curious...I've heard of the mid/late 90's model 'maro running consistant 11's and still being daily drivers...as in the owner drives it to the track, races it, and then drives it home..."
Just about every Friday night at Firebird.
yea but i dont really want an ls1 or lt1 powered car...Id rather just build the chassis and put a body onto it and use my own idea for the power plant...
oh yea im going to sound so stupid when i say this and a lot of people might laugh but i am a kid trying to learn the ways of the jedi :D or so to speak... What does the term "hook" mean in drag racing terminology? I hear it all the time and i have an idea but what is it exactly?
"hook"=Hooking up ...or I.E Traction.
Just my opinion here, but I dont know if I would go as far as a tube chassis on a car that runs 11's:HMMM:
BG
NHRA Super Street is a class where you could do that and you don't even need a tube chassis....
(quote)
Super Street cars run on a 10.90 index (6.95 1/8 mile), using a heads-up start and a .5 second pro tree. Reserved for full-bodied cars with full fenders, hood, grille, top, windshield and functional doors. Sports cars, street roadsters, vans and panel trucks permitted. Open-wheel altereds, dragsters, funny cars or motorcycles prohibited. Minimum weight including driver, 8-cylinder cars, 2,800 lbs; 6-cylinder cars 2,000 lbs; 4-cylinder and rotary cars, 1,200 lbs.
A typical car here would be a gutted early 70's Duster with stock windshield but Lexan in all other windows and a 360 motor. A 5-point rollbar is all that is needed if the floor and firewall are unaltered.
so basically, i could go out and buy a camaro, put an 8 point cage in it, make the power plant able to run 11's, and go racin? Thats idea but i still don't really want the ls/lt powerplant...its easier to computer tune the msd standalone setup and it doesn't cost a lot of money for the program...My boss looked at the ls programming programs and they are outrageous...
Do an early Camaro with a 454 and 5-point rollbar. You wouldn't have to spend much on the motor to make it go 10.90
early camaro like? 80's? 70's? how early? I dont really want to fork out the cash for a 60-70's model camaro...they are not easy to come by. the 80's camaro's are a dime a dozen though :)
what trans would you go with? the powerglide is the most consistant and thats the way i'd go, but maybe im wrong? and what about the 4 link and tubs? yes or no on that?
You could use a ladder bar rear or a 4-link. The reason I'd go ahead with a 4-link is so the car wouldn't have to be upgraded to it later. They're harder to tune than a ladder bar, but they'll do a better job when you eventually upgrade to Super Gas or Super Comp or you can sell the car easier to someone who wants to upgrade.
You'll want to use a 12" to 13" wide slick, so whatever you have to do to get 'em in is what you'll have to do. I'd go with a narrowed 9" Ford housing, again, so it won't have to be upgraded later and/or the car will be easier to sell.
I was trying to keep it simple with the rollbar, but if you are gonna do it, do it right the first time and install at least an 8-point cage that'll certify to 8.50.
If, by this time, you can see hundred dollar bills flying out of your bank account, you're seeing it in the right light. It's just not cheap to build a race car, no matter how you slice it.
The generally accepted break-point for a 'glide or 3-speed is about 2,800 lbs, so it's your call. Any heavier than that, use the 3-speed.
Yea i see the 100's flying out of my pocket but thats ok i already knew that...but thats why i live and breathe cars, when im not in church or having a nice evening with my girl, my mind is on cars, so that is where my extra money goes...
What i would like to do is an 80's camaro but they have a funny frame...is this going to cause a problem or should i look for something a little different? I know there are a ton of other cars that would actually make better drag cars...Im kinda thinkin about a nova with a either a big small block or a small big block in it...I dont want to go 5 seconds in the 1/8th but 7 would be nice...I know a woman that used to race in a 66 Nova with a naturally aspirated gasoline 424 chevy...kind of a funny motor but it hooked up and ran like crazy...7 flat in the 1/8th and 11 flat in the 1/4th, carburated with a barry grant silver claw...that motor is actually sitting on the floor in the shop that I work at...they put the original motor back in the car and sold it when she decided not to race anymore...Any suggestions on a car that would make a great racing application? Novas are, from what i can tell, the most recommended building block but i am wanting other help...
Camaro's are unibody cars, all they need to hook up an work good are frame ties and an 8 point roll bar. A strong big block with a glide along with a 9" Ford rear end, ladder bars, frame ties, and the 8 point should run Super Street with no problem.
I guess i always thought that after 1982, chevrolet changed the frame...hrmmm...k...Im gonna keep car hunting, im still very open to anything but Im kinda partial to camaros. I dunno...this is one of those times in life where i want it to be exactly what i want so it's going to be a couple weeks before i buy a car to work with.
Are you wanting a street car for your daily driver or a race car for Super Street? If you make a competitive race car it's gonna suck as a street car and vice versa. It might run the number, but it won't be competitive. The Super Street/Gas/Comp guys are all running electonic delay boxes, watching them race is "BORING". Some tracks have a no electronic delay class and those are better.
You say you don't want the LS1/LT1 motors, but if you really want a quick street car that is still a reasonable daily driver, that is a great way to go. The other way is horsepower in a bottle(Nitrous Oxide), or some sort of blower set up. You mention that you don't have the money too spend on the LS1, but then say you want to build a tube chassis. Building a chassis that will be safe for the street and work at the track is way expensive. Just ask Blown Goat or ProZ28. Not trying to run down your idea, just trying to inject a little reality into the discussion.
There is a fellow here in town with a 70's Camaro, street driven, that is running high nines now, through he mufflers on street legal tires. He has the frames tied with an 8 point cage and ladder bars. He has a built up 383 small block with one of the small street blowers and a 150 Nitrous shot. Without the Nitrous, it runs low 11s. He has the car stripped, minimum interior and even no inner fenders up front. It looks kinda raggedy, but don't line up against him. He chose the pre-75 camaro because that is the borderline for smog inspection. And speaking of smog legal, check your state laws. There are guys running smog legal EFI cars in the 11s here in CA.
I've rambled long enough, good luck with your project, what ever you decide to do.
Pat
4th Gen Camaros are heavy. About 3500-3600 Lbs. The only reason those cars see 11's is because of the Gen III (LS) engine family. And not with carburators. EFI and modern engine tech equals fast times in streetable trim.
Hopper you've already got some very good advise from these guys here, so I guess all I'll do is give you a little more input on the tube chassis idea.
Just as stu said doin a tube chassis is a very expensive project, not to mention extremely time consuming. I've been building my car now for going on 6 years (mostly weekend work, but still 6 yrs).
When you do a tube chassis you need to ethier build a jig (such as Pro Z did) to build the chassis off of, or do like I did and spend a ton of time shimming everything so that it is all level and safe. I havent added it up to the penny (scared too:LOL: ) but if I had to guess how much I had invested into just my chassis and chassis pieces(suspension, steering etc...) I'd say its around $7000+ just into those pieces.
Then you have the extra bonus of not having any of the stock mounting points for the body or any other parts to go off of with a tube chassis:whacked: I spent the better part of 2 years just lining up all my body panels and making mounts for the fenders and other big pieces that mount to the chassis.
I dont want to scare you away from doing a tube chassis car because they are the safest and fastest way to go, but unless you looking to run in the super pro or simuliar class where your talkin 8 second times, I really think your time and money could be used better on the car.
Whatever you decide on I'm sure everyone will be glad to offer some advise to you to obtain your goal.
BG
Someone gave a suggestion on the first page (I think it was Dave) and I'd agree with his thoughts. Some frame connectors, 8 pt cage, BBC, 9" rear, maybe mini tub it and a few other things and you'd be able to hit the times your wanting without alot of hassle. Only thing I "might" change is rather than a glide I'd think about a T400, unless you cut some more weight from the car. If you are up above the 2800/2900 lb mark the T400 would get you moving a bit harder off the line than a glide, but if you drop some weight in the car then the glide is the way to go.
ok i've been doing a little more thinking...v8 s10's are always a good route...they are easier to tub as well...There's a guy in town that has a 350 v8 s10 that needs a starter, brakes, tires, paint, and a serious tune up...he's asking 1600 dollars...I think he'd go for 1300...the interior is already gutted and the exhaust is a little screwed up, the pipe that is still connected is about 2 inches off the ground...i know that is wrong, and the other exhaust pipe is in the bed...I'm thinking maybe buy an s10, and like ebay an ls1 or lt1 to drop into it...mini tub, stick it on the bottle, 8 point cage...what do you guys think?