Model A Ratrod -- what's a good drivetrain donor car?

Hi all,
I picked up a 30 Model A 5 window coupe project. :D It's rough, but I have more time than money. :whacked:

So my thoughts now go to a good donor car. I'm thinking something I can have sit outside, and take motor, tranny, rear axle, sheet metal for patch panels, and all the little bits and parts that come along that you need to build a ratrod, that a parts car would be good for.

So, thinking Chevy small block and auto tranny, what's the best donor vehicle considering rear axle width for my coupe, and a good tranny (TH350?).

I tried to do a search here in a bunch of the different forums, but I didn't really get much info. Most seem to think an 8" ford rear end is good, and won't need to be narrowed, but I'd prefer chevy small block power, and I'm looking for the best ONE car to get all my stuff from.

I'm thinking Mid-70's Chevy Nova? Impala? Am I close? I did see an 86 Caprice with a 305/auto for $500 that ran great.

Any thoughts? I know you all probably know this stuff already, but I'm a newb, so my apologies. :)

Thanks.
Pete

Some real advantages to doing it this way. You figure, one car drives up and you start transferring parts to the other car. Plus you get the advantage of being able to drive the donor for a while to see how it runs.

Mid '70's something mid-sized would probably be best, as the rear axles are sometimes too wide under a Caprice, or similar. But if you are going to channel the A deep, you may actually need a wide rear axle to clear the body when it gets dropped.

The one pain is storing all of the parts and getting rid of the carcass, but if you have the room, it works and can save you a ton of money. Obviously, you will still have to buy some pieces, like suspension stuff, but you will end up with engine, trans, driveshaft, rear axle, wiring, and more.

Post some pictures as you go, it will be a great tool for others who are thinking along the same lines.

Go for it.:3dSMILE: :3dSMILE:

Don

If you're going to do a Rat Rod, then do it right. Put whatever money you have into safety. Brakes, steering, and suspension are your first priority. As far as a drivetrain, choose whatever fits into your budget. I've learned through the years that Chevy is the cheapest, simply because it's plentiful. Also, most of the parts are interchangeable throughout the years. Ford on the other hand is cheap, but not like Chevy. They're a little harder to find. Interchanging parts on a Ford gets a little tricky. You can still use a Ford rearend with a Chevy eng/trans/driveshaft. They make a universal joint to join a Chevy driveshaft to a Ford rear. Mopar is another story. Unless you have every part needed on hand, you may end up doing a lot of searching, and buying of expensive aftermarket parts. Remember, it's going to be a Rat Rod, you want it to look like it's held together with bailing wire and bubblegum. And that's the whole point. You want it to LOOK that way. Underneath all that crap, you want it safe. Make the Rat Rodders proud.

Thanks a lot guys. I guess I'm on the right track then with a midsize. I'll try to get some more info on dimensions of axles and stuff before I go too far.

While I'm not safety neurotic, I 'do' want the car to be safe, at least as safe as a car held together by wood can be. :|

Won't have the 30 at my place until this weekend. I'll try to post some pics when I can.

Thanks again.
Pete

Hey Pete,

What part of Boston are you from? Beantown is my old stomping ground. Educated at Wentworth and UMass. Worked on Court street. Lived in Norwood.

Iakota,
Cool, man. I'm between Worcester and Boston. Went to school at ULowell and WPI. Small world.

You've got a nice place in San Antonio as well - Alamo and the riverwalk. I've spent a few nights there as well.

Pete

I left Boston in 1965, but kept returning to further my education. Boston and Cambridge are a great place for colleges and universities, but I can't handle the weather. Anything below 70* is frigid to me. Here in San Antonio we have four seasons...Almost summer, summer, still summer, and Christmas. Boston has only two seasons...Ten months of winter and two months of damn poor sledding. Anyways...Have you started on the model A yet?

Here's a pretty good site for finding different dimensions. I agree that it would be neat to get everything from one donor car, but don't sacrifice a good rear end just because it's an 8" Ford (for instance). The 8" will hold up to a Chevy V8 better than most of the wimpy Chevrolet rears you'll find in the smaller cars.
http://www.teufert.net/other/rear%20...dimensions.htm

Richard is right, there is a reason the 8 and 9 inch are the most popular for these sort of swaps...................they fit well. Plus, most of them come with simple brackets to hold leaf springs, so you have less to torch off to get them ready for coil overs or a traverse spring setup.

There is a u joint that is 1/2 chevy and 1/2 ford, so you can use your chevy driveshaft and mate it to the ford rear axle.

These rear ends were put under every mid sized ford from the mid 60's to the late 80's, so there are tons of them out there, and cheap, too.


Don

Thanks for all the help guys!

OK - so the plan sounds like:

A used rear axle - Ford 8" or 9"
And a chevy donor car for motor, tranny, driveshaft, wiring, etc.

I'll be looking for highway gearing - I'm just building a driver, not a high performance rocket, so I'm not looking for 4.56 gears or anything. highway rear axle - 2.73, 3.07...

What would be a good donor Ford car for a rear end - to fit the rear of a Model A coupe? Maverick? It seems most of the cars in my local u-pick-it yard are 80's and up, so I'm not sure how many Mavericks I'll find. Newer is probably better - what would be a good modern donor for a rear?

That plan's probably better, actually, because then the donor shell will still be on wheels for the scrap man to take away.

Pick up the A on Saturday. Pics to follow.

Yeah, the weather up here is crappy. But, my family is here, and there's more to life than cars. My HotRodChick and I sit by the fire most of the winter. ;)

Thanks again
Pete

Your donor car should have a SBC, Ford rearend, mopar disc, early GM calipers, small bucket seats out of a Fiero or such 15" Chrysler wheels:D and well....I guess you get the idea HUH?

Here are the pics! It's going to be a long slow road, but man, this thing is too cool.:D

Pete

Wow!!! Great start. These coupes ARE cool, and yours looks exceptionally good.


Keep posting pix.


Don

An S10 Two Wheel Drive PicKup Rearend Is The Perfect Width For A Model A With Fenders. Thats What I Have Under My Roadster Pickup---brian

Your going to love building that car. Now, you have to set up your shop with TV, refrig, stereo, A/C, heat, nice chairs,microwave, coffee pot:rolleyes: and all the other essentials that are required, oh yeah, you'll need some tools and stuff too but, you can get those later.:3dSMILE: Seriously, when you get ready to lift the body off be sure to reinforce it on the inside. Are you planning to box this frame or sell out, oh, I mean buy a manufactured frame? You probably have a build plan by now so.....let's here it.:cool:

wow great bones to start with i am in envy.

An S10 Two Wheel Drive PicKup Rearend Is The Perfect Width For A Model A With Fenders. Thats What I Have Under My Roadster Pickup---brian


Brian is right. I'm using one under my '39. They come in lots of different ratios and even posi-traction. They are so plentiful you can pick them up pretty cheap, and the strength is good, too. Chrome center section covers can be put on to dress them up.


Don

Hey Pete, want some pix to get the creative juices flowing??? Check out these coupes.


Don

PeterRatCoupe, as Model A hulks go yours looks surprisingly good in the rear wheel wells, bottom of the cowl and rear panel. Think it over before you go radical. I wish I had found a metal car but as Brian shows the fenders can look good so I am putting 'glass fenders on a 'glass roadster body! Assuming you got the doors with the rest of the car maybe you could use 'glass fenders and put most of the work into a mild top chop and of course my favorite idea of a green plastic insert in the roof hole. Just for comment, the Brookville A frame is exceptionally straight and is set up on a jig with laser alignment but mine came with a kickup in the rear. The kickup plus the solid rectangular tube nature of the frame has been excellent to work on up till now when I have decided to add a rear bumper to protect the 'glass fenders. What this means is some messing around with the heavy spring steel rear bumper brackets and Brian found the front brackets very hard to saw through. That is that if you decide to box the present frame you might look ahead and see where the rear bumper brackets fit INSIDE the frame channel and leave that part unboxed to use the brackets later on. I think I will solve my problem by sawing/burning off the inward bending part of the bumper brackets but you could keep the bolt-on design if you so choose and save some trouble later on if you look at the underside of a complete stock A. Well I am just rambling, but it looks like you have some nice metal there so don't cut it up too much, just a little 2" chop would be nice!
By the way, I have a '74 Maverick rear with just rebuilt pumpkin, no change in width but it does seem a tad wide with 3 1/2" offset wheels. That is to say if you use a Ford 8" rear you will need to pay attention the to the wheel offset. I may switch to another set of wheels with a 4" offset just to get outside clearance with the fenders but of course without fenders that is no problem as long as you clear the inner fender wells, but a deep channel like the gray coupe above could cause a need for planning the rear width carefully.
Don Shillady
Retired Scientist/teen rodder

Guys, thanks so much for the info and comments.:)

Don, that red satin coupe is fabulous. Trips, lake pipes, no fenders, no hubcaps... that's where I'm looking to go. Traditional, simple, retro rod. No giant horsepower motor - just a reliable setup for driving. That car, in satin black, lose the drilled visor, and you're just about where I want to be. I'm not sure on a top chop. I'm about 6'3", and I've already crawled inside my coupe and sat down, and it's not cavernous, so I'm thinking maybe leave it just as it is, no channel, no chop, just give it a good stance with a drop front axle, and a proper rear. Big and little tires... you get the idea.

Yeah, the Suburban was chock full of the rest of the parts. Door, radiator, shell, winshield parts, seat parts, hoods, roof parts, wood parts, etc., etc. Picked it up from a guy who restores As to show condition, so I pretty much got whatever parts were in his garage that he felt weren't up to his standards, or parts that he had better examples of, but are fine for a hot rod, at least to me.

My Dad had a model A as a kid, and then a 46 Ford with a flathead, so flathead power is not out of the question. My Dad's pretty excited about the rod, so I'd like to have a flatty. But I'm not building a show car, so I'll want to drive it a LOT when it's done, thus I'm concerned about the reliability of the flatty, after what I've read on cracking blocks, etc., but that's way off anyway, so I'll have to wait and see. SBC would appear to be so much simpler, and I know them well, and it's cheaper, and more plentiful. But, the flatty is more traditional, and has a higher "Dad factor." :D

I'd like to box the frame and use it, as it appears to be in decent shape (and I'm not made of money), and I'm not putting in a 500 hp motor. Once I get the body off and sand and inspect the frame fully, we'll see where it stands.

Pete