help choosing how to proceed with primer

Hey guys, I just dropped off the fenders for our F1 so that they could be blasted and I could patch them. the guy at the place recommended blasting and patching before priming and then taking them back just to have the flash rust dusted off. I figured he knows more about it than I do PLUS it is expensive to have them powder coat prime the fenders (which is what they do).

My question is this, which way should I go, powder coat prime or self-etch prime (by a paint shop I guess)? and what should I be looking at cost wise difference? It is 160 to have them blast all 4 fenders, 500 he said to have them blasted and powder coat prime. at that rate the cost to have the whole truck done would be what I thought the frickin' paintjob could be had for. what gives?

the advantage I could think of with the powder coat prime was that theoretically it would get in places the paint might now.

one more thing, once primed, either way, how long would it be safe to have it, if garage kept exclusively, before painting it?

Never have used the powder coat primer, I use the etch primer or self etching primer.... As for how long it will last inside, should be fine, but it's just primer so it can easily be scratched up... another thing to be careful of is getting oil or grease on primered surfaces..... If you don't get it all off before you start the body work, it can lead to adhesion problems with whatever you put over it......

Dago
I had started a similar thread last year, but not to powder coat. On my truck,I used a 3m drill bit attached abrasive pad. As long as there is no paint, or very little, the pads are great at taking the rust off. It took about 1 1/2 hours, per fender per side to do this. I then used a rust converter/primer, which converts whatever rust is left to black primer(zinc oxide I believe, but don't quote me on it). I then sand off whatever comes off easily, making sure no rust is exposed which there shouldn't be, or reprime with converter an leave on. Then a quick coat of etch primer, which some people say is not necessary, followed by a two part epoxy primer, which will prime and seal the metal indefinately. Dave brings up a good point about grease though. It is inevitable you'll be redoing and cleaning as you go.
I like the epoxy primer, because it keeps me from putting a time line on the final paint job. I also don't have to worry about water getting under the primer and starting the rust process/paint failure all over again. The epoxy primer is about 70.00 bucks a quart for both parts needed. I bought a cheap sprayer from Harbor frieght that works fine, but wasted paint because it wasn't gravity fed!

$160.00 to blast all four fenders clean is a good deal though. I've read about metal fatigue and sheet metal warping with blasting, but those old fenders are pretty thick.
I read this article on rust removal, seemed good to me.
http://www.secondchancegarage.com/public/206.cfm
Good luck Steve.

I always spray on a coat of PPG's DPLF Epoxy sealer on any raw /blasted metal to keep it from surface rusting !
Just handling the raw steel with your hands will start to form rust , as your hands have moisture and the salt from this moisture attach to the raw metal starting it to rust . I usually wear those disposable blue rubber shop gloves when handling the raw metal too .
All it takes is a 3M 3" scotch brite abrasive pad on a die grinder to remove the epoxy primer for the repair .

Sure beats wasting money watching your panel surface rust again after just having it sand blasted !

even a light coat of rattle can rustoleum gray or red oxide primer is better then leaving it raw metal ;)
Need to protect it as must as possible because as soon as the air hits it , it starts to rust .

is that primer expensive? does it come rattle can or am I looking at using a gun? the biggest problem is I don't really have anywhere to use a gun (I have one that you put the paint in the pot and hook air up to it).

thanks guys, sorry I know so little about this.

Red

The DPLF is a 2 part epoxy system , and requires the use of a paint gun and air .
But rustoleum comes in a spray bomb , and I think most automotive type stores carry it .

I have the rattle can rustoleum primer, but I didn't know if I used it would it then have to be taken off later too? I have been using it as I work on the bed to cut down on flash rust after I grind and repair, but it is all getting blasted later so I wasn't worried about it.

thanks.

I have used it (rustoleum ) on smaller parts like brackets , braces , and such , and sprayed PPG's DBU or DBC BC/CC system over it and they have weathered well .
Did it to a Jeep roll bar and it still looks good !

I would think if you used a good substrate like DPLF ( or something comparable by another brand ) , over the rustoleum after all repairs are done , and then use a compatible primer for sanding repairs smooth , to accept a compatible top coat system , all would be good .

Just apply enough rustoleum to coat the bare metal , 1-2 coats max , dont need to just load it up , all you would need is just enough to cover the raw metal to keep it from rusting so you can handle it for repairs :)

great, thanks very much. that makes it a lot easier, and I can rattle can stuff in the front yard. at least this stuff, once it comes to the larger pieces I don't know what I'll do. I probably need to find a good local shop that doesnt' charge an arm and a leg.

Red

do you have an auto body school/ Votech close by ?
Maybe you could get the primer shot cheaper by the students .

Doesnt hurt to look around , or go to paint jobbers and see if some one does some painting on the side for a reduced price .

materials arent cheap any more , as I am doing a 86 Bronco II on the side and I have $700 in just paint right now . and thats my cost :eek: Thats not including the little bondo i used , or the primer , or the tape and paper , or sand paper . add all that and its around 1000 bucks .

I know a guy who paints for a living. I asked him about using Rustoleum on the under coat to seal the metal. He told me he had a bad experience painting over it one time where the overcoat/finish coat wouldn't stick. He's not sure why, said it probably was a brand incompatibility issue. But since he'll probably spray the truck for me, he said to stay away from it. This is just one guy's opinion. He also did a motorcycle for me, that I swear I primed with rustoleum so who know, just thought I'd throw that out there. The motorcyle turned out great!:3dSMILE:

NAPA sells an etching/epoxy spray can primer that will work great for what you need and can be used as a solid base for paint later. It will work under any of the "name brand" paint lines and is pretty good quality. It isn't cheap, at roughly $7 a can, but the fact that it doesn't have to come back off and WILL protect your freshly cleaned metal is very well worth it! Donny

Thats why I never usually mix brands , I am a PPG man through and through .
30 years and only have had 2 things go bad in 30 years of using it . Both were not my fault , one was found that a catalyst i was using was packaged with out a certain chemical in the batch , and 1980 sealer i used to use a ton of , didnt seem to have the body it normally had , and i shot it and painted over it , and it turned to cottage cheese ....LOL . Found out it was trailings from cleaning the vat they canned instead of disposing it :eek:

If you dont feel comfortable using Rustoleum , ask a jobber where you will purchase your paint , if they have a recommendation on an aerosol metal etch prime that will be compatible with your top sub-straight .

I just talked to my uncle and he said he has a bigger sprayer over at his friends that has a big yard (shop yard, not backyard type setup) and that I can spray over there. with that in mind, which product should I use and how should I proceed? he said since it is just for protection and it'll get sanded later etc. that it doesn't matter than I'm not a professional at it. :o

Red

I would go to a Paint jobber and see what line they carry and ask them what your planning . They will help steer you in the right direction .
You wont need to purchase everything at once , but knowing you need maybe a quart of the right primer & catalyst will be a start . Might get an idea of what it will all cost you .

And also get the P-sheets on the products you buy , as these have much needed info on the products , like compatible items , what temps are best , mix ratios , application process , 1 coat or 2 coats , air pressure, needle and nozzle for gun spraying , its just nice to read over it to kind of get an idea of what your spraying :)

no one has ever said you have to spray paint. Just get some cheap epoxy like Napa/Sherwin Williams (yes there exactly the same thing). Or even use the self etch primer.Then mix it without reducer and brush it on. Leaves horrible brush strokes but your going to sand it later for the following primer surfacer.As for Rustoleum it is a Alkaloid based paint and all tho its done I would not spray epoxy or eurethane over it. My experience is you can spray polyester over anything and it will lock it in(even tho they recommend only spraying it over bare metal or fillers). Also I like to have just the area I am working on blasted then send it back after the repair and have the whole thing blasted(particularly the weld). I don't blast the outer sheetmetal unless its rusty instead I use a sander to strip it.