Teach an old dog new tricks

[Redbeard1]

hello people i am not new to hot rods i have build a few cars like my 72 elcomino.but now it's my son's turn and he wants to beef up his 95 Grand Prix GTP .anyway i have to help of course,he wants to run at least 12sec 1/4 mile.
the car has 3.1 fule injected motor, what i need to know is where to look for tips like pistons,cam,crank and what computer problems are we going to have?can some one please point me in the right direction?
Thanks Redbeard1

[cffisher]

Well first WELCOME to CHR
Second I realy don't think your going to see 12's with a 3.1 engine. Its only like 160 hp. If I'm wrong you'll know it as a bunch of others will know for sure.
Charlie

[Itoldyouso]

Yeah, I agree. You might with turbocharging or nitros, but life expectancy will be shakey.

I could be wrong too, but a built SBC will give you a better shot at it, consistently.

Don

[techinspector1]

My best advice: Leave the GTP alone so that it's his dependable daily driver. Go to ebay motors and type in "project car". Look for the lightest car you can find and afford that is rear wheel drive, one without a motor or trans. Now, find the biggest motor you can that is cheap in your area. It might be a 440 Chrysler or a 472 or 500 Cadillac or whatever. In many cases, it's better to buy the whole car and use what you can off it, then sell the rest of the sheet metal and glass to recoup some of your investment. If you've never done an engine swap, go to amazon.com and order some of the books on the subject (swap, swaps, swapping).

It should be easy to get into the 11's with such a car. You can run as quick as 11.50 at the drag strip without needing a roll bar. All you would need is a good Snell approved helmet and driveshaft loop.

Build a tow bar to tow the rod to the strip with the GTP. This kid does not need a car that will go 12's on the street anyway. It's a recipe for disaster in my opinion.

[Redbeard1]

well we were thinking about a 3.8L Series III -- Supercharged engine. it has 260 hp but i would like to stick with the 3.1.
what i want to know is can i get a steel crank,higher compression pistons ,and simi rad cam for the 3.1? i really dont want to go with V8 in a front wheel drive car no room to work.

[Itoldyouso]

The problem is that a car is only as strong as it's weakest link. Once you start beefing up the engine the trans will start taking a beating, then the axles and cv joints will want to break, etc. What these guys are trying to tell you is that this car really isn't a good candidate for these kinds of ets. Is it possible, sure, but the investment to get there and keep it running will be more than a different car and setup.

Don

[Redbeard1]

My best advice: Leave the GTP alone so that it's his dependable daily driver. Go to ebay motors and type in "project car". Look for the lightest car you can find and afford that is rear wheel drive, one without a motor or trans. Now, find the biggest motor you can that is cheap in your area. It might be a 440 Chrysler or a 472 or 500 Cadillac or whatever. In many cases, it's better to buy the whole car and use what you can off it, then sell the rest of the sheet metal and glass to recoup some of your investment. If you've never done an engine swap, go to amazon.com and order some of the books on the subject (swap, swaps, swapping).

It should be easy to get into the 11's with such a car. You can run as quick as 11.50 at the drag strip without needing a roll bar. All you would need is a good Snell approved helmet and driveshaft loop.

Build a tow bar to tow the rod to the strip with the GTP. This kid does not need a car that will go 12's on the street anyway. It's a recipe for disaster in my opinion.

well i tryed to give him my 81 comaro, i have a bigblock 454 with 13.5 to 1 popups with roller cam i am going to put in the comaro but he doesnt want it
he wants his gand prix i live 1 mile from Thundervalley dragstrip here in oklahoma he takes his car there on friday night test and tune to play around and he is a good kid and know's i'll kick his tail if he drags on the street's.

[Redbeard1]

The problem is that a car is only as strong as it's weakest link. Once you start beefing up the engine the trans will start taking a beating, then the axles and cv joints will want to break, etc. What these guys are trying to tell you is that this car really isn't a good candidate for these kinds of ets. Is it possible, sure, but the investment to get there and keep it running will be more than a different car and setup.

Don

i understand all this and have told this to my son many times but it's his car and his money so what do you do.i just need to know can i get a steel crank ,10.5 to 1 flat top piston's and a good cam and what computer problems will i have?

[Itoldyouso]

Give us a baseline on the performance. What is the car turning stock?


Don

[Redbeard1]

Give us a baseline on the performance. What is the car turning stock?


Don

the car runs low 16's with those big ass speakers and amps in the trunk i am sure he could dump a hole lot of weight from the car if he wants.

[Itoldyouso]

Well, every 1,000 lbs dropped picks up about one second et, so if you can drop 4,000 lbs................................

On a serious note, it may have seemed that we were down on your Son doing this project, and in some respects that isn't fair, so sorry if at least my posts seemed to go that direction. All we (at least I can speak for myself) were trying to do is maybe suggest that for the outlay to get this particular car to possiblly turn those numbers you could build something even faster and cheaper.

I mentioned a couple weeks ago I had a customer in my office and he mentioned he races a Honda (I think it was a Honda) and it turns 9's. However, he has a bazillion dollars in it, and stuff breaks all the time because it is so overstressed. But it is what he likes to do. First of all, I don't know how much, if any, speed equipment is available for that engine of yours. Secondly, it won't be cheap if it is.

You will pretty much be pioneering this project I would suspect, unless there are tons of devotees out there that I am not aware of. The easiest and cheapest way to have fun at the strip is to take the lightest car you can find and shove in the biggest motor you can afford, as some members mentioned earlier. Anytime you take a car that was made to be comfortable and economical and turn it into a drag car, you have to be prepared to do lots of work and spend lots of money. If you and your Son have those resources and the desire to spend them, go for it.

I hope this clears the air a little and let's you know our thinking on it.

Let us know how it turns out.

Don