Been waiting for years to get a vehicle like this, and finally have found one, a 52 Chevy. Wanting to put a 350 in place of the 6, but just thinking where to start right now, what do you guys think??
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Been waiting for years to get a vehicle like this, and finally have found one, a 52 Chevy. Wanting to put a 350 in place of the 6, but just thinking where to start right now, what do you guys think??
OK, sit down and figure out what you want the truck to be when finished. How do you want it to drive? Automatic or stick? All street or some drag race? What percentage? Power brakes or reasonable manual brakes? Armstrong steering or power steering? Stock suspension or different? If different, do you want to buy something ready to install and bolt in or weld in or do you want to do a clip swap yourself or a frame swap or whatever? How much of this work can you do yourself? Do you have a place to work on the truck? Do you have tools? Do you have time? Do you have money?
If you have time, place, money, knowledge and tools, start at the rear of the truck. Either buy a pre-engineered 4-link rear suspension or design and build your own using coilovers or coils and shocks. If you know nothing about designing a suspension, don't let that stop you. I, along with others on this site, can point you in the right direction. It ain't rocket surgery:eek:. It's just plain old hot rodding and a little geometry. Oftentimes it's just as simple as swapping in another rear clip, like maybe one from a '78-'86 GM G body (Malibu, Monte Carlo, El Camino, Olds Cutlass, Pontiac Grand Prix, Buick Regal). The track on these cars is very close to the track of the old truck, so it wouldn't look goofy like some swaps do. If this idea appeals to you, begin searching around your area for a derelict donor car. You may decide you'd like to use the front clip out of it also for the power steering and power disc brakes. Motor mounts would already be in place to accept the small block Chevy.
The rear that's in the truck now will not hold up very long with a modern V8 up front, so you'll have to change out the rear anyway. May as well get it over with first. If you lose interest in the old truck, it will be more saleable with the rear done and no motor than it would be with a hot rod motor and stock rear. Anyway, that's how I see it.
Here's an article I wrote for the Crankshaft Coalition Wiki. It was for the benefit of one of the members on this forum who was frame swapping an International pickup....Read through it and see if it sounds like something you would like to tackle...with help of course.
http://www.crankshaftcoalition.com/wiki/Frame_Swap
I'll only add to what Richard said, Plan your work, Work your plan!!! A build always goes best when you decide on a "theme" for the truck!!!! If you're artistically inclined or have a friend that is work through some sketches of the look you want when it's done.
As this is your first build of such a project, take a lot of pics before and during the dissassembly process--it's a great help when prepping things for paint and for assembly to know what parts you'll need.
Also, not meaning to put a stick in your spokes but just a couple things we've all found to be true through the course of a build:
1. It's going to take longer then you thought.
2. It's going to cost more then you thought.
Finally, remember the build isn't a race. Take your time and enjoy the process!!!!! The only things that separates a first rate build from just another truck is fit, finish, and detail!
Thanks a lot fellas. I know I will definitely be returning for Q&A's and ideas! I'm soon to be 21 years old, so I have plenty of time to turn this ole' metal heap into my masterpiece. My senior year should fly by, which will leave more time to work on her. But will make due for the summer while I'm home. Thanks again for direction and support, will keep ya fellas updated
Its great being 21, and having older wiser heads to keep you on track. And what the guys have written above is wisdom that I wish I had at 21.
From my many hot rodding failures I have learned the following:
Buying shine stuff makes your bedroom look cool, but doesnt get the hot rod finished any quicker
Borrowing money at 21 to build your hot rod isnt so wise
Having a 'mechanical mate" is a godsend
Start with the end in mind (and dont change the plan)
Making the hot rod nice and driveable is a good idea
Making a hot rod that looks way cool but is a dog to drive is not a good idea
Drag racing is great fun and very addictive
And addictive costs plenty
If I was 21 and building that truck, I would look doing a frame swap. And dont rule out the Jappa utes from the early 90s either.
Down here they are common, and often rusty and usually cheap. A few of them even have the 5 on 4 1/2 Ford stud pattern, disc brakes and a diff that okay for a mild sbc. If your truck needs floors anyhow, then its not a major to fabricate one to fit a new frame.
All the best with your project.
Todd
I have done 4 of these trucks and love them. I can help as well just ask
Thanks again for the advice fellas, its always welcome and greatly appreciated. will definitely be asking a lot of questions, about what fits what doesnt and what works and what doesnt. the less experimenting i have to do will allow my creativity to flourish with the guidance and direction of my "mentors". Thanks again guys, and happy hot roddin'
What is a Jappa utes?Quote:
Originally Posted by Hot Rod Todd
Jappa Utes are vehicles from those little islands to the west of Hawaii that lost the second world war but got the last laugh when they started flooding the world with there little recircled tin can cars...:eek:
Utes are what you fellas call trucks,we and our Aussie mates refer to our light commercial vehicles as utilities and you folk call them either trucks or pickups.
Thanks Whiplash.
They are the Japanese 4 cylinder "minitrucks" that have taken over the world. well the do down here anyway. I think the Toyota Hilux has been the best selling commercial vehicle in New Zealand for over 15 years.
So a Jappa Ute is a Toyota Hilux, a Nissan Navara, a Mitsubishi L200, a Madza Bounty/Ford Ranger or an Isuzu/holden Rodeo.
Im guessing you would best recognise the old Chevvy Luv.
Their chassis fit well under old pickups. keeps the front wheels well under the guards and allows heaps of room at the back for big rubber.
I owned when I was a kid a 1953 chevy car.If the trucks are the same,there are two firewall supports that needs to be trimmed of removed if any V8 engine is put in there.The rear end was a torque tube style if memory serves me correctly.
Yeah that car was a learning curve first hot rod with training wheels still in place.:rolleyes:I put in a Hemi 354 in it and the wt of 750 lbs engine made the stock front end drop like a rock.It was a chewing gum,baling wire mod that I did get running and drove it only acouple of times.The front wheels bowed out so bad from the wt of the engine it was hard to control.:eek::whacked:
Sold the old rust bucket to a guy who pulled the engine back out and put it into his Dodge station wagon the right way as a sleeper.
WhipLash & Hot Rod Todd, your from New Zealand? Im thinking about doing a study abroad program there this upcoming spring. May have to get together and do a little hot roddin'. haha
One of the first things you need to do is to "design" your ride by picking a style: low-rider, retro, custom, stock, etc. Find a photo of a truck you really like and emulate it with your build. That way you will have a visual goal in mind because building anything is a matter of making a lot of choices, and you should only make each choice one time. Otherwise, it gets expensive doing it a second time. Once you have your plan firmly in mind, you can start. These trucks are very cool when they are nicely done. A lot of people on this forum are more than willing to assist you. Ask away!
If you come down here, you can be sure that you will be looked after and that you will have a great time.Quote:
Originally Posted by TylerZ07
I may have to take you up on that offer. the country looks beautiful. Thanks for all the support fellas. now im just lookin around for a frame to slide under her. and tryin to think of a name for her. haha
We'll she is now officially mine. She's sittin in the back and after a nice scrub down, you can see that she is three different colors... (green, Blue, and of course.. RUST). Very excited, like a kid in a candy store. haha.
I was talkin to a friend of mine at work and he said his uncle has a lot of stuff laying around his garage. SO i took a ride up to staunton today to see it. He had a 366 big block, a tranny with a transfer case, and either 3 1/2 or 3 1/4 ton axles with 31" tires and 1 ton suspension and all the piping for the manifold. His uncle wasnt there when i left but my friend called me and told me he would take 1200 for everything.. What do you guys think? Everything looks to be in great working condition.
also there is a blazer frame/axles in the bulletin board for 600.
So lets here it guys.. sound good or should i pass on it??
366 is a turd.
Track is too wide on Blazer axles.
Slow down.
Just my opinion.
Can I ask? What is it that YOU WANT to build? What's the look that pushes your buttons?
why do you say the 366 is a turd? it still has a lot of room to be bored out another 180. any suggestions then?
Nice truck Partner! Just about a year ago I was in your same position, Listen to techinspector1, he has been the upmost helpful to me in my build. I wanted to put my truck on a new frame and do exactally what your talking about. Everyone told me to put a IFS on it and leave everything else alone. Looking back at all the issues I have had and all the added cost putting a whole new chassis under it, I would have come out leaps and bounds ahead with a IFS frontend and good 9" rear or whatever your choice of rear axle. These guys on here will steer you in the right direction becuase Im sure they have already done it:-) you can check out my build been over a year and just have it mechanically finished and have not even touched the cosmetics. Enjoy the build, thats a sweet truck!!!
Lance
Yeah, slow down. Examine all your options. Talk with some more people. Attend some car shows. Talk to other builders who have done what you intend to do. Find out why they did what they did and if they are happy with it.Quote:
Originally Posted by TylerZ07
There will come a day when the truck is all done and you want to sell it and move on. If it isn't done properly and with appeal to the masses, it's gonna be tough to get any money back out of it. Of course you have to please yourself, but you also have to please others when it's time to sell.
The 366 is the redheaded stepchild of Chevy motors. I don't think in the entire lineup of bowtie horsepower, has there ever been a motor that is more undesireable from a hotrodding standpoint. Pat McCarthy is the resident BBC expert on this forum. Ask his opinion. Send him a PM if you don't want to ask on the open forum. Chevrolet put them in dump trucks and buses for a reason, because that's where they will do the best job. If you're gonna go to a big block, start with a 4.250" or larger bore block. Anyway, you now have my opinion. I'm just trying to look out for your best interests.
I do appreciate the great advice. I will avoid the 366 now. ill be looking on craiglist and the local bulletin board to find me something im fond, of course running it by you guys first. haha. I have decided the look and color i want though.
I want this exact color, the prettiest color ive ever seen on a vehicle
and im pretty positive i want to chop the top a little.
I also want to convert it to 4WD..so there's a start
Okay so you have a vision of what your truck can look like. Thats great.
Im guessing that you want 4wd as in SUV/truck type and sitting high with big wheels all round. And not a canyon burner with a car based 4wd system (tho that would be pretty cool)
Then I would suggest you get the chassis specs of your truck - wheelbase, track width etc and figuring that a chassis swap will be easier than fitting all the 4wd stuff to your old chassis, start comparing it to whats out there.
Buying a complete wreck will be much cheaper than buying the bits one at a time.
If you want 4x4 check the specs of a s-10 frame. It will take some work and it is a narrow track but it will work.
We did a 41 ona 4x4 blazer frame becuase that is what the customer wanted and had.
I can tell you he spent a TON of money for us to fix it and make it work. IMO not worth it. We had to widen the fenders 4" to cover the tires. He had more money in the body work of the fenders then what the truck is worth but that is what he wanted.
I agree slowdown unless you have endless funds and mad skills. Go to shows see what else is out there and who and where to get the parts you want. The carlsile truck show is not far from you and coming up soon Go there you will see many of these type trucks in 2wd and 4wd see what they did talk with the owners. People always want to talk about their rides.
I have seen this conversion a couple of times, and they just don't look right. You would be better off using the original frame and graft specific parts to it. I have seen Mustang II and Volare front suspensions grafted to those frames with success, and they look really good. Take Iceburgh's advice and talk with guys at shows whose vehicles you wish to model yours after. They are great sources for what works and what doesn't in these conversions. My only advice is to take your time and think it through so you do not make mistakes that have to be redone.
welcome to CHR! I'm up the road from you a bit 2-3 hours maybe. These guys will be far more help than I will, but I'll throw a word or two in. I've been building my car to hopefully be very driveable and reliable with a new IFS and fuel injected 350 (good for about 17/24 mpg), but also very basic with a 10 bolt and parallel leaf springs and minimal body mods. chopping it and doing 4wd sounds very good and all, but just make sure you will have the funds, time, skill and tools to do it all or you will end up with a half done truck and no money to finish it. maybe build the truck, prime it and save the chop to reevaluate later after you get some miles on it. Even if you are very skilled you might find time to be an issue. I didn't start building the car with my dad until after i graduated college. Working a full time job eats up a whole lot of time and then if you have another hobby or girlfriend weeks may go by with no work on the truck done. Of course I don't know your situation, but my best advice is keep it simple, get the truck running and enjoy it.
Ha FordCoupe, I'm seem to be living the same life as you except a few years removed (1 year of college remaining, and the girlfriend taking time) haha. I do appreciate the sincere and enceouraging Advice guys, I can't say it enough. Right now the straight six needs a fuel tank and a battery and she SHOULD be running.. I hope. Will keep you all posted,
Anyone attending the carlisle car show? Wouldn't mind meeting up with some of you guys up there
I will be there.... I work for Meguairs so stop by our display and say hi
Tyler, i am building a '49 now, check my thread. I can give you some pointers as well. As for a 4wd, look at a Trailblazer, see if you can find one cheap and use the running gear. If you get an SS then you get the LS2 and all wheel drive. That stuff can get pricey and difficult, but figure out what you really want before you start buying and building stuff. buying stuff because it is the right price is not the best tactic if its not the correct parts. http://clubhotrod.com/forums/showthread.php?t=44828
If you havent already done so, have a good look at Flippers thread on his 48 Chev truck. Its a good read.
http://www.clubhotrod.com/forums/sho...threadid=28959
I'm with Rumrumm on this one. My plan would be boxing the rails on the existing frame, then fabbing up the necessary mount points to use the transfer case, differentials, and suspension out of a donor truck. Haven't seen many bolt-the-body-on-a-newer-frame deals that come out looking right. Usually the track width is wrong and or the wheelbase is wrong and most tend to "comprimise" on the dimensions and the truck ends up looking tacky.
Got a sign in my garage that sez, "If you don't have the time and the money to do it right, when are you going to have the time and the money to do it over?". It's there as a constant reminder to me to avoid the quickie shortcut deals that always seem to cause way more problems then they ever cure!!!!!
I[COLO
R="Blue"][/COLOR] If you don't have the time and money to do it right, when will you have the time and money to do again?
Excellent advice thanks Dave, I have suffered from me taking shortcuts too, and kick myself for my stupidity,take three steps forward and four backwards.:eek:
Start simple.I have done about 8 of these ole trucks.Start with how much money do you have? Next how much rust. No since in starting on something rusted to h e ll.What do you have for tools? Skill? Place to do it?Fall in love with something you can do not something you will have to dump quick in 5 years when you run out of???????
Oh and keep the stock frame..frame swaps are just asking for headaches.
:o[QUOTE=
Oh and keep the stock frame..frame swaps are just asking for headaches.[/QUOTE]
The frame is rusted to hell, there isn't a lot of hope in saving iy from what I can see. Working 7 days a week doesn't allow me much time to look under it
You haven't said what your skill set is yet? Me, i could build a frame, i boxed my frame for my '49 though, came out great. Buying a frame will cost you $8000+ from what i have seen. Doing a frame swap, i could build one much cheaper than that, plus by the time you modify a swapped frame, you'll be sacrificing something (length, track width, ride height) plus have a lot of time and money tied up in getting everything to mount correctly. Hope you can weld. Even a rusted Stock frame, i could salvage and use, unless you can stick your hand through it for the full length. make sure you know what you are getting into no matter what route you choose.
Welcome. I'm another truck builder here. I think as Richard and Dave have said, figuring out what to do is important first. For example a 350 chevy engine is easy to come by already running, for a reasonable cost. Or you can rebuild one for less because there are so many parts for them.
Secondly, if money is an issue, make a list of what you can do now by yourself, and tackle those things first. Stay away from attractive stuff like guages, wheels tires, uphulstry until later when your almost done. One of the guys on here said he's built 4 of these. He probably has a great idea where to start and what order to go!
Lastly, stock steering will save you a ton of time and technical figuring on your own. IFS is great, but either you take it to a shop, or have tools and knowledge and cash to work it out. It opens several cans of worms early on in your build, but would be the place to start physically. Mentally, I'd go to a chevy site where people have been there done that to a truck just like yours(which is a real beauty by the way!) and see what they have done. After a few different reads, you'll start to see a theme of what makes sense and what doesn't.
I think you will also find stores online like LMC trucks ( http://www.lmctruck.com/ ), and MACS auto parts ( http://macsautoparts.com/Default.asp...cd2=1276967363 ) , for stock stuff and no limit engineering, ( http://nolimit.net/ ) and classic performance parts ( http://www.classicperform.com/ for hot rod conversion stuff that comes with instructions and a support phone line are very helpfull (got a motor mount for my truck that is for my 460 motor here and front brake conversion setup, etc.. makes it easier to build!)
Anyway I hope this is helpful.
I think the guys on here would probably recogmend figuring out the chasis first, boxing your frame after you get your suspension, brakes and power train worked out, then working your way back up to the body and linkages.
Or you can follow my build thread http://www.clubhotrod.com/forums/showthread.php?t=34090 and meader around at different things, but get to the same place hopefully n the end!:LOL:
Seriously cool truck welcome and have fun!
Heres a bunch of research all in one place for you.
http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...d.php?t=274702
Hey man. I got a few suggestions. i have always wanted to do this too. But like other people have said I have never seen it done right. In my opinion if you go through with making a 4x4 don't go bigger then 35-37" tires. Actually with the designs I have done these seem to work perfect. Just need to find the right lift to make it go together aesthetically (this is the biggest downfall on the trucks I saw is tire fitment). Here is a pic (no you are not the first to think this up, lol) of an original 1953 Chevy pick-up with an original 1953 Coleman conversion kit to make it 4x4 which consisted of a front axle and transfer case and brackets, adapters and emblems. The rear axle stayed the same. Now the book I have read and it has excellent info on how to restore your truck so this can help you with a few ideas. It is done section by section. ie drivetrain, body, etc. I know you are not doing a resto but it will be helpful on the do's and don'ts of this truck. How to Restore Your Chevrolet Pickup [Paperback]
Amazon has it here: http://www.amazon.com/How-Restore-Yo.../dp/0879385006
Good luck and have fun.
Another thing is I don't think the short box trucks look right lifted. I would recommend looking for the longbox stepside if you plan to lift it. It seems to me they look too short. If you can throw a little money at it another idea is they have companies out there making aftermarket frames for these trucks. maybe you can get one with no suspension brackets or just rear suspension brackets. But mind you they are about 5 grand.