New chest grabber....

Just when you thought you had heard all there was to hear about the Nazis in power, comes this chest-grabber........

This could be a scandal of epic proportions and on that makes Nixon's Watergate or Clinton's Monica Lewinsky affair pale by comparison.

Why was there neither rhyme nor reason as to which dealerships of the Chrysler Corporation were to be closed? Roll the clock back to the weeks just before Chrysler declared bankruptcy. Chrysler, like GM, was in dire straits and the Federal Government "graciously" offered to "buy the company", keep them out of bankruptcy and "save jobs". Chrysler was, in the words of Obama and his administration, "too big to fail". Same story with GM.

The Feds organized their "Automotive Task Force" to fix Chrysler and GM. Obama, in an act that was and is 100% UNCONSTITUTIONAL, appointed a guy named Steve Rattner to be the White House's official Car Czar. Literally, that's what his title was. Rattner was the liason between Obama, Chrysler and GM.

Initially, the national media reported that Chrysler had concocted the list of dealerships to be dismantled. Not true. The Washington Examiner, Newsmax, Fox News and a host of other news agencies discovered the the list of dealerships to be imploded was put together by the "Automotive Task Force", headed by none other than the aforesaid "Car Czar", Mr. Steve Rattner.

Now, the plot thickens. Remember earlier we said that there was neither rhyme nor reason why certain dealerships were closed while others remained in business? Actually, there is a very interesting pattern as to who was closed down and who stayed open. The Washington Examiner and Newsmax exposed the connection. Amazingly, of the 789 dealerships closed by the Federal Government, 788 had donated money exclusively to Republican political causes, while contributing nothing to Democratic political causes. The only "Democratic" dealership on the list was found to have donated $7,700 to Hillary's campaign and a bit over $2,000 to John Edwards. This same dealership reportedly also gave $200 to Obama's campaign.

Steve Rattner is the guy who put the list together. Well, he happens to be married to Maureen White. Maureen happens to be the former National Finance Chairman of the Democratic National Committee. As such, she had access to campaign donation records from everyone in the nation, Republican, Democrat or Independent.

On that list of dealerships being closed down, a wierd thing happened in Arkansas, Northern Louisiana and Southern Missouri. It seems that Bill Clinton's former White House Chief of Staff, Mack McClarty, owns a chain of dealerships in that region, partnered with a fellow named Robert Johnson. Now, Johnson happens to be the founder of Black Entertainment Television and was a huge Obama supporter and financier. These guys own a half dozen Chrysler stores under the company title of RLJ-McClarty-Landers. Interestingly, none of their dealerships were ordered closed. Not one! Eight competing dealerships located near the dealerships owned by RLJ-McClarty-Landers were shut down. Thus, by the stroke of the pen of one of Obama's henchmen, these major Obama supporters now have a virtual monopoly on Chrysler sales in their zone.

Now, if you thought Chrysler is owned by Fiat, you are mistaken. Under the Federal Court ruling, 65% of Chrysler is now owned by the Federal Government and the United Auto Workers/Fiat owns 20%. The other 15% is still privately owned and presumably will be traded on the appropriate exchange.

As horrifying as this may be for you to comprehend and being as how this used to be the United States of America, it would appear that the President has the power to destroy private businesses and eliminate upwards of 100,000 jobs just because the principals of the firms don't agree with his political agenda. This is Nazi Germany stuff and it's happening right here, right now, in our own back yard. There are voices in Washington demanding an explanation, but the "Automotive Task Force" has released no information to the public or to any of the Senators demanding answers for what has been done.

Steve Rattner has since resigned and been replaced by former Steel Workers Union boss Ron Bloom. According to CBS News, Rattner left "to return to private life and spend time with his family". Treasury Secretary Tim Geithner said "I hope he takes another opportunity to bring his unique skills to government service in the future". Interestingly, Rattner is under investigation for a multi-million dollar pay-to-play investment bank scandal in New York.

PLEASE SHARE THIS WITH ANYONE YOU KNOW WHO LOST THEIR JOB AT A CHRYSLER/DODGE/JEEP DEALERSHIP SO THEY CAN HELP CLEAN OUT THE HOUSE AND SENATE IN NOVEMBER.

landers McLarty is who i bought my toyota from .. and yes they are buying up every dealorship in the area ..

Tech, That is truely terrifying! People believe that things of this nature can't and won't be done! How nieve we've become to the power of our government. My guess is that Steve "RAT"tner is home guarding his family from the dangerous condition he created. I will pass this on to everyone I know!..Thanks....CR

We have A Ford, Chevy, GMC, Toyota ,Subaru, Volvo, Audi. Kia,VW and almost everything else Dealer(5 locations), the only three brands he does not sell are Hyundi, Honda and Chrysler. Last year our only Dodge dealer was shut down, He was the type of dealer that wrote a check when they unloaded the truck and was not a burdon to Chrysler. He has remained open selling used cars and has not laid off any employees. We now have a new Franchised Dodge dealership opening 1/4 mile from the old.Guess who owns it

Now I am not in any way a supporter of the government ownership process, but from Snopes it appears that the Car Czar list story may not be factual. Here's a link, you can make your own assessment:
http://www.snopes.com/politics/business/chrysler.asp

But then, who controls Snopes??? I have no idea!!:LOL:

I printed a lot of copys of this to hand out at Cool April Nights in Redding this next month>

Interesting. Snopes did prove this to be false. But what was interesting is that something like 88% of all car dealorships donate to Republican party vs. Democrat. Which make sense since most of the auto retrictions are proposed by the Democrats (both good and bad!) I.E. safety stuff vs. smog!
Still wouldn't be supprised to hear stuff like this really happening reguardless if it's the Dems or Repubs, because they all are politicians! Like the guy said on the Hunt for Red October
": Listen, I'm a politician which means I'm a cheat and a liar, and when I'm not kissing babies I'm stealing their lollipops. But it also means I keep my options open. "

This really is a “gut wrencher” for several reasons. The federal government should not be in the car business as a matter of course. I could certainly support an exception for a real war time emergency to redirect production to military vehicles or factory retooling to address a true national emergency – but poor management by GM and Chrysler could have been better dealt with by no government intervention and allowing the consumer to dictate which automobiles will be supported in this country. While the initial impact would have been severe, the long term outcome would have been a leaner automotive manufacturing entity that produced cars and trucks that people really want as would be evidenced by what “get’s sold”…

As it is, we are being force fed a product that represents a small segment of the American people who will always embrace the “politically correct” agenda and trust the government to take care of them. I am not at all opposed to energy efficient automobiles but I would like to choose without the government providing me “several choices” none of which I want. As most on this site, I remember being able to choose between a 140 cubic inch Ford Falcon or a dual-quad Mercury Marauder. If you want a hybrid Toyota, great – I may want a different car that does a “bit more” – like haul a 7,000 trailer or my (heaven forbid) four of five kids in relative comfort and safety.

Steven Rattner is probably a criminal. He’s not yet been indicted, but as of March 10th, per New York Attorney General Andrew Cuomo, he (Rattner), “remains under investigation in his office's long probe of the former New York State Comptroller, Alan Hevesi.” What made Rattner even remotely qualified to decide on the ultimate fate of General Motors and Chrysler defies logic and his calculations that show GM bringing money back to the American people are just not correct.

Barron’s Magazine, which has pimped GM as the “hot IPO of 2010,” agrees that taxpayers will not come out ahead, i.e., “Even if the debt rallies, bondholders will fare the worst, reflecting the restructuring of GM by the Obama administration that favored the union over bondholders despite their similar legal claims. The union is also apt to do better than taxpayers, based on its sweet deal.”

The same Barron’s report cites a JP Morgan analyst’s “aggressive” valuation of GM at $63 billion, with $50 billion given as a more conservative valuation. Considering GM was functionally worth nothing prior to the bailout, and was revived to the tune of about $50 billion (not counting GMAC, retooling loans, etc..) the $50 billion valuation is probably closer to reality.

The Chrysler dealers in general, were hosed – plain and simple. It will be interesting to see if the current arbitration efforts will result in any of them being able to stay open - might be hard after a year of being beat to death and shunned by their corporate headquarters.

I rarely put any faith in Snope’s after they have been outed as a left-leading husband/wife team with little to no real research capability. I’m far more inclined to go with the Wall Street Journal’s opinion (right wing it may be, but with one of the best records for reporting truth) than anything Snope’s may say.

Check out this link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=thR-lVuztIY&NR=1

Passionate posts concerning the manner in which the government of this country is destroying the automobile industry has nothing to do with what one eats – it is a reflection of what one believes and is willing to stand up for.

Thanks, Richard, et al, for sharing your passion and expressing your opinion. Last time I checked, that was still okay in America.

Just my 2 cents
Glenn

Just politics as usual, don't really understand why anyone would be shocked or upset!!!!

As long as the politicians can keep going with the one party blaming the other party, and all us voters just calling each other names they have no reason to "fix" anything...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Evolvo

If this is a chest grabber, its cause you've been swallowing to much bullshit!

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I smell a Democrat....
I suspect you voted for him.....
And I suspect you support him....
I can only hope the results of the actions of these Socialist lunatics come back to bite you and others of your ilk....

Glenn, thanks for being real....

Steve, how in the name of all that is holy can anyone affirm or deny a story like this. Get real. If it walks like a duck, looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it's more than likely a duck.

Dang, You people will believe any bullshit they print, Snopes.com has proved it was all FALSE! But you all refuse to believe it! What is this world coming to!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by '23T-Pail

Dang, You people will believe any bullshit they print, Snopes.com has proved it was all FALSE! But you all refuse to believe it! What is this world coming to!

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Holy sheep dung Batman, it's another Democrat!!!!!!
Son, how do you figure anyone could prove or dis-prove what I posted? Is Barack gonna say, yep, I did it. Or, nope, I didn't do it. And this other clown, Rattner, is being investigated. But we know we can trust him to tell the truth.......Nope, I didn't do it!!!

P.T. Barnum said it best....."There's a sucker born every minute"
And all of you suckers lined up to vote for a bunch of Socialists in 2008.

That's OK, November's coming :LOL::LOL::LOL::LOL::LOL::LOL::LOL:

It's a fine distraction to quiibble over details. The Snopes piece may inject some statistical reality in the discussion, but "proves" nothing. It too suffers from logic falisies.

Here's a simple way to judge the direction we're going. When this country ascended to greatness did we have more or less government control? Has China been ascending because their government exercised more or less central planning? Has Europe regained the prowess they enjoyed a couple hundred years ago as it has become a breeding ground of nanny states? And before anyone is quick to think "oh.....Europe isn't so bad.", keep in mind, they've had our protection and correction for most of the last century (which we graciously don't wipe their nose in). Who's going to be our protector when we descend into social democracy (at best)? We allow our politicians free rein even though they have a demonstrative history of lousy management and unkept promises. Some are even gullible enough to buy into the distractions thrown their way and buy into the blame the: rich, corporations, profit is bad, yada yada. Ignorance abounds. Or at least I hope it's ignorance. Ignorance can be cured.............stupidity can't.

and with 2010 not being a presidential election year, any guesses on what voter turnout will be at the polls?????

Bob, I agree with everything you said except Stupidity can't be cured, IT'S TERMINAL.
I will ask all of our liberal friends just one question. When was the last time a poor person provided you with a well paying job?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by techinspector1

Son, how do you figure anyone could prove or dis-prove what I posted? LOL:

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I ain't your SON Daddy-0.. And NOT a Democrap like you either..
:LOL:

G-o-l-l-l-e-e!!!
You can always tell a lib when he is confronted with facts.

We have 2 MoPar dealerships and a GM dealership that have been closed that I have good information. There were others, but I don't have enough background about. These three 'stores' were profitable and have been for many years and published the data to prove that fact. One of the MoPars and the GM were among the largest in the area, the other MoPar was a mom and pop 'store' that most folks really liked. The large MoPar - the owner who has died, a significant local Republican contributor. His Ford dealership - still going very well in this county(Saratoga County, NY - which - surprise - is still a Republican stronghold, and where I currently live - and a county that has a significant $$ surplus which no other NY county can say).

As far as Snopes, yeah, some of the facts presented are marginal at best, but I have also seen a couple Snopes "proofs" that were dead wrong!! In essence, the article that you are presenting Richard, has enough that all should consider not only the auto sales industry as well as others that the Obamanation is working to take over in his socialization of America.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by IC2

G-o-l-l-l-e-e!!!
You can always tell a lib when he is confronted with facts.

We have 2 MoPar dealerships and a GM dealership that have been closed that I have good information. There were others, but I don't have enough background about. These three 'stores' were profitable and have been for many years and published the data to prove that fact. One of the MoPars and the GM were among the largest in the area, the other MoPar was a mom and pop 'store' that most folks really liked. The large MoPar - the owner who has died, a significant local Republican contributor. His Ford dealership - still going very well in this county(Saratoga County, NY - which - surprise - is still a Republican stronghold, and where I currently live - and a county that has a significant $$ surplus which no other NY county can say).

As far as Snopes, yeah, some of the facts presented are marginal at best, but I have also seen a couple Snopes "proofs" that were dead wrong!! In essence, the article that you are presenting Richard, has enough that all should consider not only the auto sales industry as well as others that the Obamanation is working to take over in his socialization of America.

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The most dramatic statement I have seen lately....
"The United States will survive Barack Obama, but it may not survive the mindset of the voters who put him in office."

Quote:

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Originally Posted by techinspector1

I smell a Democrat....
I suspect you voted for him.....
And I suspect you support him....
I can only hope the results of the actions of these Socialist lunatics come back to bite you and others of your ilk....

Glenn, thanks for being real....

Steve, how in the name of all that is holy can anyone affirm or deny a story like this. Get real. If it walks like a duck, looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it's more than likely a duck.

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Speaking of ducks, Tech I've been skunked 4 days in a row Turkey hunting! Today they circled us just out of sight for two hours! Stillmit was fun trying to call them in!. Next mont the season is over, then back to the truck!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Evolvo

Wow tech, you really stirred it up again. Maybe the HAMB & Metalmeet have it right. NO POLITICAL POSTS ALLOWED. But since this thread is still going, what the hey.

I can only assume that all of you guys who hate this supposed march towards "socialism" refuse to accept your social security checks and would never think of using your medicare. If your shop catches fire you wouldn't even think to call that bastion of socialism, the fire department. This is, of course, ridiculous. You've earned these benefits and are entitled to them. My point being that not all social programs are bad if they benefit the society as a whole.

Tech, I see that 23T-pail already responded to you addressing him as "Son". I'll just add that I see you are at least 67 years old, should I assume that your just a senile old fart who can't keep it together? If your gonna stir it up at least show people some respect, even if they disagree with you.

Uncle Bob, A "simple" way to look at it. Nothing is simple. Remember how Eisenhower warned of the military industrial complex? Apparently no one listened. It's still one man one vote in this country, whatever that's worth. But when those elected officials, of both parties, get to Washington and are besieged by hundreds of lobbyists, none of whom work for me, it turns into selling their votes to the highest bidder. Elected officials are, after all, human beings and money is a very powerful motivator. Vote them out and others in but the problem remains the same, their human. Catch 22, the senate and congress who have the power to change the lobbying rules are paid by the lobbyists not to! Now what do we do?

NTFDAY, OK, a poor person has never offered me a job. My question to you. When was the last time a company decided to "offshore" their production and left a community floundering? If I may answer my own question, not too long ago.
I guess this goes back to Uncle Bobs statement that some see "profit" as a bad thing, of course not, but profit for the sake of profit leaves a trail of destruction in its wake. Witness the foreclosure crisis going on now.

OK, we disagree, BFD! Now how can I be sure the pinion angle on my chassis is correct?

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You would trust a Republicans answer? I suggest you ask Obama !!

Louey, I agree. The Republicans are no better than the Democrats. Both of the major political parties have led us to this mess. It is laughable though, that you think this Dike-Gate is such a big deal, when the Democrats who are in majority in the House and the Senate and have the White House have indebted the taxpayers and their children and grandchildren for trillions of dollars, but you are concerned about a few bucks that some idiot spent in a strip club. You see, that's what's wrong. The money that idiot spent was donated. The money our grandchildren owe will be extracted from them under threat of imprisonment.

The Democrats are trying to spin the healthcare bill to have the Dems look like winners because they passed it. The whole world has gone nutzoid.

Evolvo, I see you weighed in again....
"Tech, I see that 23T-pail already responded to you addressing him as "Son". I'll just add that I see you are at least 67 years old, should I assume that your just a senile old fart who can't keep it together? If your gonna stir it up at least show people some respect, even if they disagree with you."

Is character assassination the best you can do?

23T-pail, "Son" is not a bad word where I was raised.

Ken,
Has it come to that? You'll only help me if I'm Republican? A little microcosm of what goes on in D.C., I hope not.




EVOLVO- Just stirring the pot, I think everyone is disappointed with this whole mess. I know I'm am.
Ken

Quote:

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Originally Posted by techinspector1

Evolvo, I see you weighed in again....
"Tech, I see that 23T-pail already responded to you addressing him as "Son". I'll just add that I see you are at least 67 years old, should I assume that your just a senile old fart who can't keep it together? If your gonna stir it up at least show people some respect, even if they disagree with you."

Is character assassination the best you can do?

23T-pail, "Son" is not a bad word where I was raised.

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Well you once said
that your "son" turned out to be a real asshole after you left your wife and
I didn't wannbe what you raised him up to be.. I'll not reply to any of
your postings again, You do think you are better than anyone else
and also think that if someone doesn't agree with you that you have
a license to ridicule them to no end.. Bye Bye you "senile old fart". :LOL:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by '23T-Pail

Well you once said
that your "son" turned out to be a real asshole after you left your wife and
I didn't wannbe what you raised him up to be.. I'll not reply to any of
your postings again, You do think you are better than anyone else
and also think that if someone doesn't agree with you that you have
a license to ridicule them to no end.. Bye Bye you "senile old fart". :LOL:

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You seem to be all about name calling and personal attacks, with no debate about the original post. Are you that shallow in your miserable life that you can't mount a viable response and must resort to beatin' up on me?

You spent the time to go back and find out about my personal life and attack me on that level, but don't have anything to say about what's going on in our government????? What's wrong with you SON????? Same thing that's wrong with the rest of you who voted these Communists into office.

And don't anybody call me a Republican. It's both sides of the aisle who got us into this mess. The only salvation I can see is voting a straight Independent ticket in November and hope for the best.

Evolvo probably said it correctly, that it doesn't matter who we vote in, big money will own them shortly. I'm saddened that that could very well be the case.:(

Since I can't seem to generate an intelligent debate here, I'll yield the floor. I'm done with this thread. Mr. Bill, thanks for the time and space.:)

I’m somewhat hesitant to continue this thread, but I really do appreciate the passion and transparency that is being voiced here so, “what the hey” – I’ll add a bit more.

As has been stated, this is not a party problem. The Democrats and Republicans alike share the blame. I do think that reasonable term limits would be a wonderful thing as most “career” politicians are really out of touch with their constituency. I wonder when Nancy Pelosi last bought a loaf of bread or a gallon of milk? I’m pretty sure John McCain doesn’t know what a set of tires costs – he probably hasn’t kept a car long enough in the past twenty years to wear out the original set!

Herein lies the problem – we are governed by a bunch of folks in Washington DC who have no clue what the average American needs and they (the politicians) listen only to those who come to lobby with great handfuls of money. The longer one stays in Washington, the more detached they become. We vote new blood in from time-to-time, but they do not stand a chance against the “seasoned” senators and representatives so they go along with their “party line”, quickly realizing that to vote their conscience is political suicide. It’s far from perfect – but it’s what we have.

When one “side” gets fed up, we vote for “hope and change”. Before long (maybe even this fall or almost certainly in 2012), we as a nation will probably vote to “change-the-change” and the other side will not be happy. And so the cycle goes…

I do know for sure that tomorrow is Easter. All my kids and grandkids will be here. The girls will be absolutely beautiful in their dresses and my grandson will wear a little suit. Even grandpa will wear a tie tomorrow! We’ll go to church and sing and celebrate a Risen Savior. I’ll cry as I contemplate the many, many blessings I have. We’ll eat a wonderful ham (I truly feel sorry for my Jewish friends – no offense, but it’s tough to beat a good pig). The grandkids will have an Easter egg hunt and eat a lot of junk. Long about dark, Joanie and I will hug and kiss all these kids and tell them all how much we love them and to, “drive safe”. They’ll leave, I’ll cry again.

Monday I’ll get up and go to work (I was going to retire at 55, but that’s another story). I’ll complain about thing I disagree with and gripe about Obama but hopefully, I’ll remember what’s truly important and try and change my world by reaching out to one person at a time.

I had the honor of coffee having with “BADRAT” last week. He’s new to Club Hot Rod and come to find out we’re neighbors! He’s a fine man with a ton of life experience and car smarts - one of many on this site. I’d like to challenge you all to remember what we all have in common here and that’s building hot rods! I appreciate the knowledge on this site. Best place I know to research and learn. Coupled with this knowledge and long time experiences are passionate opinions – I would expect no less. We can agree to disagree without “coming to blows” eh?

About that pinion, Evolvo – looks good from here.
Uncle Bob, I’ll play on your team any day.
Louey – I hurt for those in the Midwest who need work. Teach a kid to turn a wrench or how to wax a car.
Stovens and Dave – keep on “keepin’ on” with the good advice and balance you bring.
23T, breathe deep and know that we value your contributions on this site.
And Tech, you can call me “son” anytime - where I come from that’s a okay thing to do when “we’s all pit racin’”

Regards All,
Glenn

1. Pay senators and congressmen 50 thousand a year max.
2. Take away the cushy medical plans, they should do what everyone else does.
3. Hold them criminally liable for and misdeeds that affect the public.
4. No more deluxe retirement plans at our cost. They should have to plan for their own retirement just like we do.
5. Take away their ability to vote themselves raises and benefits. If their performance is exemplary then let the public vote them a bonus.

Many politicians begin their offices with good intent but end up mired by way things have been done for years. These positions should be for serving the people of America, not for a particular political agenda. I hold all politicians in equal contempt. They may be a necessary evil, but we do have the power to change this. Learn about the political process. Get out and vote, make your opinion count.
Just my opinion.

Term limits, as Glenn mentioned are probably are last best hope for salvaging this democracy that we used to have... Want to really send a message for change in November's election? Vote out ALL the incumbants!! Starting over certainly couldn't be any worse then what we've had in the last 2 or 3 decades... Throw all the bums out, maybe a bunch of first term Senator's and Congressmen might still have a grasp on reality and actually do what their constituents what done!!!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ChryslerRodder

1. Pay senators and congressmen 50 thousand a year max.
2. Take away the cushy medical plans, they should do what everyone else does.
3. Hold them criminally liable for and misdeeds that affect the public.
4. No more deluxe retirement plans at our cost. They should have to plan for their own retirement just like we do.
5. Take away their ability to vote themselves raises and benefits. If their performance is exemplary then let the public vote them a bonus.

Many politicians begin their offices with good intent but end up mired by way things have been done for years. These positions should be for serving the people of America, not for a particular political agenda. I hold all politicians in equal contempt. They may be a necessary evil, but we do have the power to change this. Learn about the political process. Get out and vote, make your opinion count.
Just my opinion.

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Top five points...This could work down here too..Or anywhere for that matter.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dave Severson

Term limits, as Glenn mentioned are probably are last best hope for salvaging this democracy that we used to have... Want to really send a message for change in November's election? Vote out ALL the incumbants!! Starting over certainly couldn't be any worse then what we've had in the last 2 or 3 decades... Throw all the bums out, maybe a bunch of first term Senator's and Congressmen might still have a grasp on reality and actually do what their constituents what done!!!

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Dave, thanks for that. It's what I've been preaching to anyone who will listen for the last 6 months and will continue to preach until the November elections. It just makes sense that if we keep voting in new blood, they won't have much of a chance to make long term deals. VOTE OUT ALL THE INCUMBENTS. :)

For an interesting take on independent candidates who will have no party affiliation nor owe anyone for war chest money, go to www.goooh.com
These are your next door neighbors who are throwing their hat in the ring for a chance to represent you. If something like this would take off, we might have a good chance to take this country back and have it run like the majority of the taxpayers want it run and deserve to have it run.

Glenn, thank you very much for an extraordinary post. Eloquently written.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by stovens

Interesting. Snopes did prove this to be false. But what was interesting is that something like 88% of all car dealorships donate to Republican party vs. Democrat. Which make sense since most of the auto retrictions are proposed by the Democrats (both good and bad!) I.E. safety stuff vs. smog!
Still wouldn't be supprised to hear stuff like this really happening reguardless if it's the Dems or Repubs, because they all are politicians! Like the guy said on the Hunt for Red October
": Listen, I'm a politician which means I'm a cheat and a liar, and when I'm not kissing babies I'm stealing their lollipops. But it also means I keep my options open. "

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I received the following in an email this morning.........

Snopes.com is not giving the whole story!

I always suspected David and Barbara Mikkelson who were behind "Snopes" were Obama and liberal oriented --now we know!!

Go to Google!!
Who watches the watchers?
Please read it all to the bottom!
Guess we have to use "Truth or Fiction" now .
For the past few years www.snopes.com has positioned itself, or others have labeled it, as the 'tell-all final word' on any comment, claim and email . But for several years people tried to find out who exactly was behind snopes.com
Only recently did Wikipedia get to the bottom of it - kinda makes you wonder what they were hiding . Well, finally we know . It is run by a husband and wife team - that's right, no big office of investigators and researchers, no team of lawyers . It's just a mom-and-pop operation that began as a hobby .

David and Barbara Mikkelson in the San Fernando Valley of California started the website about 13 years ago - and they have no formal background or experience in investigative research .

After a few years it gained popularity believing it to be unbiased and neutral, but over the past couple of years people started asking questions who was behind it and did they have a selfish motivation?
The reason for the questions - or skepticisms - is a result of snopes.com claiming to have the bottom line facts to certain questions or issue when in fact they have been proven wrong .

Also, there were criticisms the Mikkelsons were not really investigating and getting to the 'true' bottom of various issues .
A few months ago, when my State Farm agent Bud Gregg in Mandeville hoisted a political sign referencing Barack Obamaand made a big splash across the Internet, 'supposedly' the Mikkelson's claim to have researched this issue before posting their findings on snopes.com . In their statement they claimed the corporate office of State Farm pressured Gregg into taking down the sign, when in fact nothing of the sort 'ever' took place .

David Mikkelson was contacted thinking he would want to get to the bottom of this and I gave him Bud Gregg's contact phone numbers and Bud was going to give him phone numbers to the big exec's at State Farm in Illinois who would have been willing to speak with him about it .
He never called Bud . In fact, I learned from Bud Gregg no one from snopes.com ever contacted anyone with State Farm . Yet, snopes.com http://snopes.com/ issued a statement as the 'final factual word' on the issue as if they did all their homework and got to the bottom of things - not!
Then it has been learned the Mikkelson's are very Democratic (party) and extremely liberal .

As we all now know from this presidential election, liberals have a purpose agenda to discredit anything that appears to be conservative .There has been much criticism lately over the Internet with people pointing out the Mikkelson's liberalism revealing itself in their web site findings .
Gee, what a shock?

So, I say this now to everyone who goes to snopes.com to get what they think to be the bottom line facts . . . 'proceed with caution .
Take what it says at face value and nothing more .
Use it only to lead you to their references where you can link to and read the sources for yourself .
Plus, you can always Google a subject and do the research yourself. It now seems apparent that's all the Mikkelson's do .

After all, I can personally vouch from my own experience for their 'not' fully looking into things .

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snopes.com

I have found this to be true also!

Many videos of Obama I tried to verify on Snopes and they said they were False . . . . Then they gave their Liberal slant . . . . !!! I have suspected some problems with snopes for some time now, but I have only caught them in half-truths . If there is any subjectivity they do an immediate full left rudder . www.truthorfiction.com A better source for verification, in my opinion .

I have recently discovered that Snopes . com is owned by a flaming liberal and this man is in the tank for Obama . There are many things they have listed on their site as a hoax and yet you can go to Youtube yourself and find the video of Obama actually saying these things . So you see, you cannot and should not trust Snopes . com . . . . ever for anything that remotely resembles truth! I don't even trust them to tell me if email chains are hoaxes anymore .

A few conservatives told me about snopes.com a few months ago and I took it upon myself to do a little research to find out if it was true .

Well, I found out for myself that it is true .

Anyway just FYI please don't use Snopes . com anymore for fact checking and make your friends aware of their political leanings as well .
Many people still think Snopes.com is neutral and they can be trusted as factual .

We need to make sure everyone is aware: that Snopes is a hoax in itself .

Quote:

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Originally Posted by chopper1

I received the following in an email this morning.........

Snopes.com is not giving the whole story!

I always suspected David and Barbara Mikkelson who were behind "Snopes" were Obama and liberal oriented --now we know!!

Go to Google!!
Who watches the watchers?
Please read it all to the bottom!
Guess we have to use "Truth or Fiction" now .
For the past few years www.snopes.com has positioned itself, or others have labeled it, as the 'tell-all final word' on any comment, claim and email . But for several years people tried to find out who exactly was behind snopes.com
Only recently did Wikipedia get to the bottom of it - kinda makes you wonder what they were hiding . Well, finally we know . It is run by a husband and wife team - that's right, no big office of investigators and researchers, no team of lawyers . It's just a mom-and-pop operation that began as a hobby .

David and Barbara Mikkelson in the San Fernando Valley of California started the website about 13 years ago - and they have no formal background or experience in investigative research .

After a few years it gained popularity believing it to be unbiased and neutral, but over the past couple of years people started asking questions who was behind it and did they have a selfish motivation?
The reason for the questions - or skepticisms - is a result of snopes.com claiming to have the bottom line facts to certain questions or issue when in fact they have been proven wrong .

Also, there were criticisms the Mikkelsons were not really investigating and getting to the 'true' bottom of various issues .
A few months ago, when my State Farm agent Bud Gregg in Mandeville hoisted a political sign referencing Barack Obamaand made a big splash across the Internet, 'supposedly' the Mikkelson's claim to have researched this issue before posting their findings on snopes.com . In their statement they claimed the corporate office of State Farm pressured Gregg into taking down the sign, when in fact nothing of the sort 'ever' took place .

David Mikkelson was contacted thinking he would want to get to the bottom of this and I gave him Bud Gregg's contact phone numbers and Bud was going to give him phone numbers to the big exec's at State Farm in Illinois who would have been willing to speak with him about it .
He never called Bud . In fact, I learned from Bud Gregg no one from snopes.com ever contacted anyone with State Farm . Yet, snopes.com http://snopes.com/ issued a statement as the 'final factual word' on the issue as if they did all their homework and got to the bottom of things - not!
Then it has been learned the Mikkelson's are very Democratic (party) and extremely liberal .

As we all now know from this presidential election, liberals have a purpose agenda to discredit anything that appears to be conservative .There has been much criticism lately over the Internet with people pointing out the Mikkelson's liberalism revealing itself in their web site findings .
Gee, what a shock?

So, I say this now to everyone who goes to snopes.com to get what they think to be the bottom line facts . . . 'proceed with caution .
Take what it says at face value and nothing more .
Use it only to lead you to their references where you can link to and read the sources for yourself .
Plus, you can always Google a subject and do the research yourself. It now seems apparent that's all the Mikkelson's do .

After all, I can personally vouch from my own experience for their 'not' fully looking into things .

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snopes.com

I have found this to be true also!

Many videos of Obama I tried to verify on Snopes and they said they were False . . . . Then they gave their Liberal slant . . . . !!! I have suspected some problems with snopes for some time now, but I have only caught them in half-truths . If there is any subjectivity they do an immediate full left rudder . www.truthorfiction.com A better source for verification, in my opinion .

I have recently discovered that Snopes . com is owned by a flaming liberal and this man is in the tank for Obama . There are many things they have listed on their site as a hoax and yet you can go to Youtube yourself and find the video of Obama actually saying these things . So you see, you cannot and should not trust Snopes . com . . . . ever for anything that remotely resembles truth! I don't even trust them to tell me if email chains are hoaxes anymore .

A few conservatives told me about snopes.com a few months ago and I took it upon myself to do a little research to find out if it was true .

Well, I found out for myself that it is true .

Anyway just FYI please don't use Snopes . com anymore for fact checking and make your friends aware of their political leanings as well .
Many people still think Snopes.com is neutral and they can be trusted as factual .

We need to make sure everyone is aware: that Snopes is a hoax in itself .

---

I believe someone on this forum in the past also questioned the accuracy of Wikipedia. Point is no one knows who to believe. We hide behind parties that we feel represent us but they really only represent themselves. I guess we have to look at multiple sources and weed out what seems right. In the end I stick with my original statement Politician shouldn't be trusted.

.... or like the article said, do your own research. Generally if I want to check the 'truthfulness' of something, I will go on line and check several on line sources and make my own judgment call. I have found some of Snopes information either misleading or only partially complete. But, with that said, usually just too lazy to bother:LOL:. As far as Wikipedia, there are many of those on-line articles that have disclaimers at the top as to whether the information is correct or even complete. Before I quote one of their statements, I'll look at some of the attachments and notes.

Well. I have leaned a few things this weekend, IF it isn't car related on this website, then it is all just bullshit from someone that wants to argue and piss other people off!
I will NOT be posting anything if it isn't car related and never again will I post anything about what that "senile old fart" posts anyway.
(BTW, I wasn't the 1st to call that "senile old fart" a "senile old fart" anyway! :lol:)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by '23T-Pail

Well. I have leaned a few things this weekend, IF it isn't car related on this website, then it is all just bullshit from someone that wants to argue and piss other people off!
I will NOT be posting anything if it isn't car related and never again will I post anything about what that "senile old fart" posts anyway.
(BTW, I wasn't the 1st to call that "senile old fart" a "senile old fart" anyway! :lol:)

---

Thank you for that update. Very informative. :whacked:

Not being apart of the staff here,but I am posting to this thread as .....well a fire fighter.

I am completely convinced that everyone who posted to this thread has tons of experience with this forum and forums like this one.Given that fact,we all know when it is time to" let it go".In fact by not continuing to post is a solution,RIGHT GUYS??.

Not taking sides here,in fact all I needed to do was skim over it to get a sense of how it was turning out.I have seen things like this so many times before as a peeper and as a Admin on a auto site.

Tech.......I respect the heck out of you and for all you know.I am just suggesting there are some topic's that are high risk that you might want to consider before starting.

So being the newbie..............all I am suggesting is we get back to the topics that the forum is all about.How about it guys........back to the hot rods we all are about???.:HMMM::HMMM::HMMM:;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 1gary

Not being apart of the staff here,but I am posting to this thread as .....well a fire fighter.

I am completely convinced that everyone who posted to this thread has tons of experience with this forum and forums like this one.Given that fact,we all know when it is time to" let it go".In fact by not continuing to post is a solution,RIGHT GUYS??.

Not taking sides here,in fact all I needed to do was skim over it to get a sense of how it was turning out.I have seen things like this so many times before as a peeper and as a Admin on a auto site.

Tech.......I respect the heck out of you and for all you know.I am just suggesting there are some topic's that are high risk that you might want to consider before starting.

So being the newbie..............all I am suggesting is we get back to the topics that the forum is all about.How about it guys........back to the hot rods we all are about???.:HMMM::HMMM::HMMM:;)

---

Gary, I appreciate your input. Notice however, that I posted what I did in Hot Rod Lounge, which is reserved for... "Shoot the breeze about all the non Hot Rod stuff..." quote and unquote.

As far as something being high risk, I care not in the least whose feathers I may ruffle. If something needs to be said, then it needs to be said. It is my opinion that these communists who have been elected to office need to have the light of truth shined on them. Some board members here cannot tolerate anything said against these communists, so they bleat out like a stuck pig. But in their ignorance, they attack the messenger rather than debating the message. Tough titty. As long as the management lets me post this stuff in a non-hot rod area, I'm gonna do it.

I've made a ton of enemies on this forum, but that does not concern me in the least. If I am able to convey what I perceive to be the truth to others who will listen, then I am doing good work the way I see it.

"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."
Edmund Burke

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by techinspector1

Gary, I appreciate your input. Notice however, that I posted what I did in Hot Rod Lounge, which is reserved for... "Shoot the breeze about all the non Hot Rod stuff..." quote and unquote.

As far as something being high risk, I care not in the least whose feathers I may ruffle. If something needs to be said, then it needs to be said. It is my opinion that these communists who have been elected to office need to have the light of truth shined on them. Some board members here cannot tolerate anything said against these communists, so they bleat out like a stuck pig. But in their ignorance, they attack the messenger rather than debating the message. Tough titty. As long as the management lets me post this stuff in a non-hot rod area, I'm gonna do it.

I've made a ton of enemies on this forum, but that does not concern me in the least. If I am able to convey what I perceive to be the truth to others who will listen, then I am doing good work the way I see it.

"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."
Edmund Burke

---

Hey-I am your new found friend...........:eek::eek::p:LOL::LOL:you just never knew that fact!!!.;);) I know full well where this thread is posted and NOT to add to this debate AT ALL.

Tech-I am suggesting the wheels fell off this thread on page two.So how about just letting it go???.Nothing more to be gained here.You posted your point and it was read by many.Just trying to reason with ya now.......

That said.......how about that cam I have been meaning to ask you about???.:):);)

Oh yeah-when I first signed on to this forum I saw these section and thought it might be about beer and great looking women.Well might be that I need to start a thread about beer and good looking women.Now that would be cool:cool:

Once again proving why we do not allow political threads on CHR.

Let me repeat it for those who have not been around here for long (or for those who are now no longer here but enjoy manipulating others to push someones buttons since they cannot).


THERE ARE NO POLITICAL THREADS ALLOWED ON CHR.


Noses get out of joint and threads become heated, and threads turn extremely ugly, you want to talk politics, I hear that politicsforum.com is the place for you.

Before anyone sends me a PM, yes, I already know. Enough said.



Bill S.