Title ?

Im looking at a 04 honda with 34000 miles , the problem with it is it has a REBUILT title. Its a two owner car, really nice shape, but im a little nervous about the rebuilt part. From what i get from the carfax report is the first owner got in a wreck 7000 miles into it. the report says she hit a concrete barrier in the drivers front. Then the motor vehical department of pennsylvania got it and fixed it, and kept it for three years. They issued the rebuilt title. Then it got bought in miami by the girl who has it now, she put about 5-7000 miles on it.

My question is for the guys in pennslyvania, how bad does an accident have to be for them to issue a rebuilt title? And what should i look out for?

That sounds like a salvage title to me, ya know when it costs more to fix it than replace it, so the insurance co junks it and pays the owner off and off to the junk yard it goes. The part that sounds funny to me is "Then the motor vehicle department of Pennsylvania got it and fixed it, and kept it for three years" I have never heard of any state bureaucracy that would go through that hassle. For the possible headaches involved, I think I'd pass unless it's a real sweet deal.....

Thats what the carfax report said, i was curious about that too.

Was the car originally titled in Pennsylvania :confused: If so where you see it being in the dept of motor vehicles is most likely when the car was at the insurance co.'s auction yard. Usually a vehicle is totalled in PA. insurance co sends it to savlage auction yard. it may sit there for some time until it is sold to a salvage yard to be parted out or rebuilt. If the car i s rebuilt it must be inspected but certified inspection station before a rebuilt title can be issued :HMMM: i have bought rebuilt title cars before but only through a friend who rebuilds them :o He dosen't mess with ones that have major damage :eek: If car only had 7000 miles on it when it was wreaked it must of had major damage for insurance co to total it.:eek:

There's 20000 miles missing there? Is it front wheel drive? Crawl underneath it and check it out real good. Leaking trans fluid? Make any noise at all when turning? When these rice toasters get hit in the front the engine/trans can be stressed as well as half shafts etc. I know, I have a 19 year old son. I think I would let it go.

Kitz

Yeah, it was titled in pennslyvania, and the rebuilt title was issued there too.

The missing miles happened when it was in the dmv`s hands.Also they had it for three years.

Just to add a little to what has been said, it doesn't depend on the state as to what constitutes a total loss, that's the insurance company's work. Since a vehicle has some salvage value even when badly damaged it doesn't necessarily mean the damage total met or exceeded the then market value. Typically, when I was in the business, a car would total when the estimated repair cost got to somewhere around 80% of market value. With a Honda they would sometimes go higher because of their very good historical value retention. It would depend too on the model. If it's a low end Civic it wasn't worth much when it was new, comparatively speaking, to say a loaded Accord. If the vehicle blew both airbags that could mean that it wouldn't take very much more structural damage to bring the car to a total loss. Not sure how the shops in PA. handle it, but replacing two bags, the controller, at least the steering wheel center, and sometimes the whole thing, and possibly the dash board, and the windshield, just that part could run a good $3-4k with the charges of a certified airbag installer. Then the sheetmetal work, paint work, maybe some light suspension work, and you could double that pretty easily. If it had a $10k market value at the time it would have been close to a goner price wise. Not a bad fix, but airbag replacement (done correctly) totaled a lot of low value cars that would have been repaired in the pre-bag days.

My advice is have a pre-purchase inspection done by a highly qualified collision repair shop and have them tell you if it was repaired correctly. If airbags are important to you and/or Brenda, have them check to make sure they're installed, some times cut rate repairs are done by not replacing the bags, controller, etc to save money.

EDIT: And it should go without saying, DON"T PAY MARKET VALUE. A salvage title knocks a big chunk out of the value because of the clouded history that has caused you concern, even in these days of CARFAX. A major buyer beware issue. Around here, depending on the car, salvage titled cars are discounted 30-50% from non-clouded title equivalents.

Well the problems I am familiar with would not allow 20 k miles. Maybe it is OK? Roll the dice? That is what it comes down to. I don't know. :HMMM:

Kitz

Bob you bring up some good points that make more sense as to why the carfax report Stresses the airbag issue, now i understand it better. And you`re right about it being a low end civic. My guess is they spun on some rain or ice and hit the center median and caused some good drivers fender damage.

My son buys these cars and drives them till them till he finds someone who does not know what a car fax is. As long as you have the intention of running it in to the ground (and not trying to sell later), give it a good test drive to a body shop. Get there opinion.

Here`s the car. And to comment to your edit Bob, the price is about halve of blue book

I used to do crash repairs for a living,find a good shop with a good reputation and ask them to put it on a chassis machine with a measuring system,probably cost you a few bucks,but if its all square and the job has been done correctly,you have a good buy,if its not square with the measuring system,you may still have saved yourself some grief in the future.:whacked:

I'm not saying stuff like that doesn't happen in PA, (they have gotten very strick on titling lately, especially street rods and reconstructed vehicles), but I would want to have the car really gone over well. By a mechanic (preferrably someone who knows Honda's) and a good body man or frame shop.

The price sounds good, but you don't want to be holding on to the steering wheel when the car is traveling in a different direction than what you are steering.:eek: :LOL:

A couple of years ago my car was totaled by a deer. My insurer told me to give it, with the title, to a salvage yard. A year later some latino dude from Texas call me and said he had the car and needed my title. I told him I had given the title to the salvage company. The car was too messed up for them to fix it for me, but they sold it to someone else to drive??? :eek: Someone is always trying to make a fast buck.:D

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Originally Posted by mopar34

I'm not saying stuff like that doesn't happen in PA, (they have gotten very strick on titling lately, especially street rods and reconstructed vehicles), but I would want to have the car really gone over well. By a mechanic (preferrably someone who knows Honda's) and a good body man or frame shop.

The price sounds good, but you don't want to be holding on to the steering wheel when the car is traveling in a different direction than what you are steering.:eek: :LOL:

A couple of years ago my car was totaled by a deer. My insurer told me to give it, with the title, to a salvage yard. A year later some latino dude from Texas call me and said he had the car and needed my title. I told him I had given the title to the salvage company. The car was too messed up for them to fix it for me, but they sold it to someone else to drive??? :eek: Someone is always trying to make a fast buck.:D

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This seems to happen the world over.Too many dangerous repairs have been carried out here,and for other reasons,like a stolen/recovery situation when a car is totalled in NZ,the vehicle is deregistered,and costs a considerable amount of money and inspection/paperwork to put it back on the road,so it doesnt happen very often now.

John, if that car was totalled out with only 7000 miles on it, that thing must have really been hit hard. Typically an insurance company will only total a car if the repairs exceed 80 percent of the value of the car. When I worked at the body shop we had cars towed in that we swore were going to be totalled out but the insurance company had them repaired instead. One was a Toyota pickup where we literally replaced the entire frame, bed, and front suspension with brand new components. We had to transfer every nut and bolt off of the old truck onto the new frame. The tab was huge, but they fixed it.

I would be very wary of this one, even though it is a good deal pricewise. There could be handling or mechanical issues that you might not know about, and you will always have a car that has a title that is suspect for any potential buyer down the road.

Don

Thanks for all the input guys, you confirmed my fears that the deal was iffy, so i bought a 95 prelude today. Im sure this was a better decision and ill sleep better knowing that my choice will possibly have saved lives. i just could not shake the feeling it was a bad move, and you guys really helped me see the light!