Thread: Warning from the past.......

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politicians lost their respectability a long time ago when serving the public became a career rather than a privilage ..

They have a wonderful machine for voting ,to take care of any skewed results.

http://www.moviesfoundonline.com/hacking_democracy.php


Here is a list a known lies .........we have been discarded in the political process and can be lied to without fear of retribution.
http://www.moviesfoundonline.com/bus...o_iraq_war.php

Originally Posted by shawnlee28

They have a wonderful machine for voting ,to take care of any skewed results.

http://www.moviesfoundonline.com/hacking_democracy.php


Here is a list a known lies .........we have been discarded in the political process and can be lied to without fear of retribution.
http://www.moviesfoundonline.com/bus...o_iraq_war.php

shawnlee, thank you for posting this "Hacking of Democracy" HBO film. I don't think I've ever been as shaken and overwhelmed over our political system than I am after viewing that film. I felt like crying like the lady did toward the end of the film. The whole voting system is a bag of worms.

I've been up on a soapbox for the past few days trying to get people to vote, only to find out that it doesn't matter anyway. Those with interests either one way or the other can skew the results as they see fit.

OK, new agenda. Before we all go out and vote, we need to fix the voting system. Is there a way to insure that each and every vote will be counted the way it was cast? Can some of you who are smarter than I am please weigh in on this and give us some help? I'm willing to go door to door to get signatures to introduce a bill to change the system and rally others together to do the same. SOMEONE has to do SOMETHING!!!!

Minor correction in the "FDR conspiracy BS."

At the time of Pearl Harbor NOBODY knew the significance that aircraft or aircraft carriers would play in the coming war. The problem we have here is retro hindsight projected from 67 years in the future from knowledge only we could know after the war was over!

The fact is to anyone who knows a damned thing about the history of the war is that Admiral Kimmel sent the carriers to bolster the Marine fighter planes at Wake and Midway Islands. For months there had been a growing number of warnings of sabotage and 5th columnists from the 160,000 people of Japanese ancestry in the Hawaiian Islands. The latest theory was to be ready to repell a submarine attack followed by seaborne landings.

Of course every other base around the Pacific had the same tensions for they were all targets. The problem was no one knew where the Japs might attack 1st. Of course withing a few day the Philippines and other US bases were attacked.

The Japs knew that Admiral Kimmel usually had the fleet in port during the weekend so Sunday was an opportune time.

Just because today we can see what's shaking anywhere from the SR 71 or satellites you must know that in pre-war time there was almost no surveilance of any kind especially aerial. Admiral Yamamoto sent his force through storm filled waters that were not travelled much. There was no way anyone could have known their exact time of arrival at any rate.

To use previous quotes by FDR about not "sending the boys to war" after the fact is almost slanderous because when that statement and ones like it were made there was no imminant threat from Japan at any specific point, target or American location. No one knew what the Japs were going to do. We have to concede here that at least 50% of what went on in pre war time was up to the Japs and not FDR or any American commander.

I suppose that if Yamomoto had chosen to attack Wake and Midway 1st there'd be some gomer writing silly crap about how we massed the carriers there cause we were told to expect an attack and the Battle of Midway would have begun the war and occurred 6 months early!

The fun and frivolity of the American penchant for teasing presidents is going a bit far when we attempt to indict them as revisionist back through history. When did FDR become the bad guy and Hirohito become some victim?

When did wimps like Chaimberlan who gave in to Hitler become more luminous than the man that was the wartime rock of Great Britain, Churhchill?

FDR, Churchill and many other personna rose to the occassion and used their talent to lead. Even if it was just for a limited occassion, that's all that was necessary.

We don't expect Medal of Honor winners to continually conduct their actions with disregard for personal safety during the course of an entire war do we? The leaders the Allies were stuck with or inherited did pretty damned good overall.

Hitler was created by the greedy European allies who sought to punish and take retributions from Germany after WW I forcing her into prolonged poverty and degradation. If the Treay of Versailles allies hadn't been raping Germanyeven at the end of the 1920s, Hitler wouldn't have had an ear.

This is exactly why the US's Marshall Plan was designed to rebuild former enemy's industries. It's is better to have economic trading partners than sullen, brooding pockets of future discontent.

So please don't use that lying BS about FDR knowing about Pearl Harbor. If the conspiracy fruitcakes spent as much time studying the war as they do buying into that weak crap they'd actually know somehting.

Originally Posted by Twitch

Minor correction in the "FDR conspiracy BS."

So please don't use that lying BS about FDR knowing about Pearl Harbor. If the conspiracy fruitcakes spent as much time studying the war as they do buying into that weak crap they'd actually know somehting.

I was waiting for this response and was starting to get concerned that I hadn't gotten it yet. Thanks for proving my point...... It's all in how it's spun isn't it????

It doesn't matter whether you believe that FDR knew or didn't and for that matter it doesn't really matter whether he knew or not....It can be spun a lot of different ways. Just like the info we saw in the video in the first posting.

To take it a step further....

There is no proof that Churchill ever used opiates in college....

There is only speculation that FDR consulted astrologers.....

Hitler never cheated on his wife....but considering he got married 3 hours before he died.....it doesn't exactly carry a lot of weight in my mind.....

A lot of what I posted was to prove a point, not to debate the intelligence capabilities of the US Military in 1941.....Everything is relative to how it's spun and by whom.

As a writer of historical articles on WWII, mostly air combat related, I see wacky crap like that often when I do research. The whole Pearl Harbor conspiracy crap is easy to debunk since if true it would have the President in intimate contact with Japanese strategy planners. Since it was Admiral Kimmel's decision to send the flat tops to Wake and Midway the President never had a part in something so low key as ship movements. It's ridiculous to imagine the Prez plotting out strategy for a couple minor islands in the vast Pacific.

The time involved for the carriers to weigh anchors and sail to the islands would have required a week's advanced knowledge that a Japanese attack was coming to Pearl so they'd be away.

Like the dumbazz 911 nuts. On one hand they call Bush an idiot then give him credit for masterminding the plot involving secretly planing explosives in the towers and more mind-numbing impossible crap.

The only conspiracy I give any credit to is the assassination of JFK.

Here is one from the history channel...........
http://www.moviesfoundonline.com/con...arl_harbor.php

Twitch, tell us more. I have always marveled that the carriers were not at Pearl Harbor during the attack and that the Battle of Midway would not have been won if the carriers were destroyed. Would the P-40s have helped if the new radar was credible at that time? Let us just be glad that the recent missle-hitting-a-satellite worked so well and be thankful that Pres. Reagan's Star wars concept has finally been proven to be possible and hope that they are building a LOT of those new ship-launched missles!

Can anyone tell me how to download the Flash to see the movie?

Don Shillady
Retired Scientist/teen rodder

This link should work Don,just hit download and follow the steps.......
http://www.adobe.com/products/flashplayer/

Tech1, Good to hear from you. I read part of that site and bookmarked the page. Pretty discouraging stuff. With more people voting this time there may be a lot of controversy. Somehow the US got to be a great country in spite of this sort of stuff but you have to wonder how. Somewhere in the US history there had to be a few real heros who did the right thing for the right reason. My favorite is Dwight David Eisenhower but some academic scholars have even criticized him! Most of the time you just have to try to use your own brain and life experience, but believe me there are only a few Conservatives in universities. Still that is where the young impressionable minds are and I did what I could to get them to "think". Hopefully equations and the laws of Physics sink in with logic to some extent, but the Rosey O'Donnells can do a lot of spin-damage to non-thinking folks. Still coming from a steel mill family I am still upset that the US steel and heavy industry was not maintained after WWII and allowed to go overseas by "global bankers", but maybe Henry Ford was too local and had the wrong take on "European Bankers", it is all a complicated business with a lot of unintended results and maybe a lack of critical thinking.

Shawnlee, I tried it your way without success, I must have Java script turned off somehow.

Don Shillady
Retired Scientist/teen rodder

Originally Posted by Twitch

Like the dumbazz 911 nuts. On one hand they call Bush an idiot then give him credit for masterminding the plot involving secretly planing explosives in the towers and more mind-numbing impossible crap.

Exactly!!

Fascinating isn't it? Same thing happened with Clinton when he was in office. It seemed like at least once a week I'd get an email from somebody showing me how Clinton was purposely ruining the country and driving it into the ground.

In fact, (believe it or not) in one example I had sent to me, it connected the dots and showed how Clinton was actually responsible for crash of TWA Flight 800, (you may remember it as the one where a commercial airplane was supposedly shot down during a naval "training excercise" and then this was covered up by the NTSB). Anyway, supposedly, on the flight was someone who was formerly part of Clinton's staff that had first hand knowlege of all the skeletons in the closet and was getting ready to go public to air out all the laundry. So, an "accident", was arranged to handle it...

I have two different acquaintances that relate to these stories and give me quite a laugh fairly often.

One will swear up and down that it is true Bush is absolutely guilty of the 9/11 plot to start an illegal war in Iraq and Afghanastan over oil, and that Michael Moore hit the nail right on the head with his movie, Farenheit 911.

The other will swear up and down that Clinton is the Anti-Christ and that allowing Hillary into office will in fact spell the end of the world. Of course that same friend swore up and down that Clinton was going to declare Marshal Law when there was controversy over who actually won the election in 2000 and suspend the change to maintain power and control.

Guess which political parties these two belong to...

Unfortunately all that normally seems to occur with all the BS propoganda flying around is that people like those two simply become even more polarized to a particular position. And, those that don't already have an opinion and that don't engage the brain, may end up pushing for the very thing they fear most...

Reminds me of a story I heard once regarding a very dangerous substance......

"Dihydrogen monoxide (DHMO) is colorless, odorless, tasteless, and sickens over 4 billion and kills over 2 million people every year (United Nations World Health Organization, 2008: www.WHO.Int). Most of these deaths are caused by accidental inhalation of DHMO, but the dangers of DHMO do not end there. Prolonged exposure to its solid form causes severe tissue damage. Symptoms of DHMO ingestion can include excessive sweating and urination, and possibly a bloated feeling, nausea, vomiting and body electrolyte imbalance. For those who have become dependent, DHMO withdrawal means certain death.

The American government has, thus far, refused to ban the production, distribution, or use of this damaging chemical due to its "importance to the economic health of this nation." In fact, the Navy and other military organizations are conducting experiments with DHMO, and designing multi-billion dollar devices to control and utilize it during warfare situations."

I urge you to act now, don't wait until it's too late, write your elected officials and ask them to put a stop to the use of this very dangerous substance. Our very survival depends on it.

A 9th grade student used a very similar warning to convince people to sign a petition to ban this deadly substance as part of a science project. The project had to do with the gulability of people based on what they were shown and told just using facts. Over 85% of people that he approached in his experiment signed the petition to ban Dihydrogen Monoxide....

Ok so I'm positive that you figured it out already;......but, just in case you're having an off day and you simply haven't sussed it yet.....Di = 2 & Mono = 1, so thats 2 hydrogen and 1 oxygen.....or H20....yeah, water. Over 85% of people he approached signed it without doing the math.

Hopefully they never get it banned....

Originally Posted by DennyW

((Fascinating isn't it? Same thing happened with Clinton when he was in office. It seemed like at least once a week I'd get an email from somebody showing me how Clinton was purposely ruining the country and driving it into the ground.))

Good one... Except, I don't think he did much with Monica around.... Is that the same thing ? Not doing his job ??

Denny,I think they call that "getting a job".

Meanwhile ,while doors are getting opened..............this is the service we get rendered...........
http://www.moviesfoundonline.com/ame...to_fascism.php

Originally Posted by DennyW

Good one... Except, I don't think he did much with Monica around....

I dunno Denny, in the stories that I heard, he did quite a lot with her around....