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I have a '32 Vicky with Ford 302 and 5speed trans. I'm too old for all that shifting and want to swap trans to Automatic. It's an after market chassis w/Heidts front end. I don't know which trans to use...C-4/C-5/AOD. Concerned about the weight and the space, this is my 1st Ford experience ever. Anyone been thru this? I'm new to this site. thanks
weight won't be a very big factor but space within the confines of a custom chassis with brake cylinders and exhaust mounting olus possible floor conflick will all effect the job------luckily for you , most aftermarket frames all pretty much have had all those issues and have designs altered/modified to adapt---------I would suggest one with od but will get bulky ---------
Welcome to CHR, Dan. If it were me I would look for an AOD, or AOD-e with an aftermarket controller, given the choices. You can get one that's built for some extra HP/torque output if that's an issue, but even stock they're pretty stout. I think you'll be happiest with an overdrive unit.
I agree with Roger, get a transmission with overdrive. After driving my car 1200 miles this year, I know that I would have hated it, with a 3 speed auto and no overdrive.
Without an overdrive, the other alternative that used to be popular was to use a taller rear end ratio, like 3.0, instead of the 3.5 ratio that I chose for my car. Even that only gives you a 17% taller gear, while an overdrive is typically 30%. I set my car up to run 2100 rpm at 80 mph.
New cars have both a tall rear end ratio and overdrive, but the transmission has a lower 1st gear to produce the same overall 1st gear ratio as I have with a very tall top gear, with the overdrive 6th. Cruising rpm at 80 might be as low as 1600-1800 rpm.
the 32 ford isn't very aerodynamic and won't be at 80mph very much of the time so you'll be operating in a lower rpm range at normally attainable crz speeds which would drop that referenced 16-1800 down to 1120 rpm---------think you can crz there????????
It'll need a real short cam.Quote:
Originally Posted by jerry clayton
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Before you start worrying you need to look at your rear tire diameter, rear gears and the final drive ratios of the tranny's you're considering. The AOD OD ratio is 0.67, so with a 31" tall and 3.55's you'll be turning 1805 at 70mph which should be good. What's your rear tire diameter and gear ratio?
The group of 32's we sometimes ride with seem to think their speedometers start at 80 mph. Especially on the way home from an event. Those guys rock!
Your not talkin bout me and sum of the gang are ya Ray ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Scooting
80 mph highway speed in a street rod!!! That doesn't give the average interstate driver much time to look at the street rod caravans as they go by. LOL! Dan Spec, you should figure what rpm you want to run the 302 at and what rear gear ratio and tire size you now have and make your trans selection from those. I would think you will need an overdrive, but you may find that you are geared for a non overdrive trans. As Tech mentioned, camshaft will influence this selection too. A 9" Ford rear sure comes in handy for these situations.
They usually get outta yer way when they look in the rearview mirror and see this.Quote:
Originally Posted by Deuce4dad
If you drive on I-25 in Colorado, you better be going close to 80 in the left lane, otherwise you get passed on the right. The speed limit is 75 and you'll never get a ticket for going 80. If I cruise at 70, then my rpm drops from 2100 to 1840. That's no problem at all for my 430 hp LS3, since the cam is quite mild.
1120 rpm would only be 43 mph in my car, but it will cruise at that rpm in overdrive, unless you drop it into 3rd manually, or come to a hill that puts some load on the engine. Then it would kick down automatically. I tend to put my transmission in drive, not OD, if I'm just cruising around town, but bump to OD, if I'm cruising over 50 mph. I get over 20 mpg in the city. I've never had to opportunity to drive the car on a road trip to check the highway mileage, but it should be even better.
327, turbo 350 9" rear with 3:00 and 32 1/2 tall tire = avg 21 1/2 mpg last year on a trip out to LARS and back. (with side trips 3400 miles) cruisin @ 80 -85 on the interstates in the left lane 4 sure
If the car had a 5 speed already, he'll probably be alright with another AUTO trans with an overdrive as the 5 speed was an overdrive trans as well. I'd use the AOD for simplicity and durability.
I'm very happy with the B&M converter lock up control on my 700R4.
I'd recommend including it for a 700R4, if you pick it.
my tires are about 30" tall and gear is 3.73, I got the AOD trans mocked up in the car now. The trans is longer, so the mount is past cross member by about 1 1/2". The drive shaft is too long now. Typical street rod stuff. I'm pricing out the driveshaft work now. Heidts is about 35 miles from me, waiting to hear back from them $$.Quote:
Originally Posted by rspears
lots of drive shaft places without going to Heidts-I'd suggest a drive shaft place, not a suspension place-------
what type of crossmember arrangement is in your chassis????????can you just move the crossmember back the amount you need?? Rember to pay attention to the u joint angles---------
Around here Inland Trucks is a good place for driveline stuff, including having custom drive shafts made, or having one shortened. I agree, find a driveline place to modify your drive shaft. Googling Belvidere Il Driveline got a link to Rockford Driveline - http://rockforddriveline.com/ You might call them, or do a little more looking....
With the specs you gave you'll be at "about" 1960rpm at 70mph in OD on the AOD. If your rear tires are a little bigger than 30" your rpms will drop a bit more.
Hey Don, You know the group. It is amazing how well those 32 bricks will travel at speed. Like a properly built engine that loves to sing, a well built suspension with the right part combination and set up married to the rest of the car variables will chase the wind with class.
Dan, on the AOD trans, just do an add on to the crossmember or pretend it wasn't there in the first place and scoot or modify it like Jerry suggested. Not a big deal. For sure I would find a driveshaft place. likely Heidts is sending it out to one themselves. A good driveshaft shop will shorten and balance it cheaper than having one built. Don't fall into the trap of someone selling you a new one.
I'll call Rockford driveline, my email came back undeliverable. Anyway I got clearance issues on the passenger side with this AOD, too fat at the pan and hits the tubing structure under the floor on passenger side. This tubing also supports the trans crossmember and the pedals and master on the drivers side.. Trans won't move over side to side enough for a straight shot back to the rear end. Off by about 1 1/2". tried to send photo but site wants URL? for a personal photo.
Here's a link to a thread on posting photo's - http://www.clubhotrod.com/shop-talk/...es-thread.html For five or less on a post you can select and upload direct from your hard drive, provided they're not too big.
Small overdrive transmission with narrow oil pan = 2004R,there are adapter kits to bolt them up to an SBF. Or you could sell the AOD to someone that has a C4 which is smaller the late 60's C4 is the smallest.
The only thing that has not been mentioned is that you need to choose the stall speed of the converter of the AOD. I have a 1500 rpm stall converter on a 700R4 with a 3.55 rear ratio and a mild SBC 350 and when I come to a steep hill on a surburban road I have to down shift to 3rd gear or the engine is close to 1700 rpm with 7.10 R15 rear tires. Even so I still only get 17 mpg on a good day. If the stall speed of the converter is higher than about 1500 rpm you will have to rev the engine to keep going or if the stall converter rpm is too low the engine will lug in OD on a hill without a down shift. Factory engineers can try out many combinations on a test track but building a "personal car" means you have to carefully match rear ratio, cam, tire size and gear ratios to the engine torque curve. The folks above all gave good advice but left out the choice of converter stall speed since at present you have a flywheel and clutch plate. I tried to calculate all this but even so I need to ocassionally downshift manually. Why not let the folks on this forum know your plans and get some feedback, I have learned a lot from the experts here. By the way you are a lucky dog to have a '32 Vicky!
Don Shillady
Retired Scientist/teen rodder