How do they do it????

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08-04-2004, 06:48 PM
brickman

How do they do it????

I have had every machinest tell me that I can't do high compression anymore because pump gas is so bad. I don't understand that because everywhere I go there are very radical rod's and they all seem to be running on pump gas. If they arn't, what are they using? In other words, what is everyone using that have giant cam stroker motors with 500 hp? Guys I need help, I have a good friend that is building a big mopar and I just can't let him walk on me!!! HELP!!!Enlighten me Guru's!! Is it really true??
08-04-2004, 06:57 PM
pro70z28

Re: How do they do it????

Quote:

Originally posted by brickman
I have had every machinest tell me that I can't do high compression anymore because pump gas is so bad. I don't understand that because everywhere I go there are very radical rod's and they all seem to be running on pump gas. If they arn't, what are they using? In other words, what is everyone using that have giant cam stroker motors with 500 hp? Guys I need help, I have a good friend that is building a big mopar and I just can't let him walk on me!!! HELP!!!Enlighten me Guru's!! Is it really true??

You could run octane booster
Water injection
Timing retard like an MSD ign. system
keep your own stash of racing gas in a drum @ home. Don't go too far from home. He He He
08-04-2004, 07:11 PM
Henry Rifle

Several answers:

Huge motors with lower compression. You can get a lot of HP out of a 454 with at 9.5 or 10:1.

Keep some CAM2 at home. If you sink $15K in a motor, what's $5.00 / gal for gas.

Nitrous
08-04-2004, 07:20 PM
Matt167

Quote:

Originally posted by Henry Rifle
\

Keep some CAM2 at home. If you sink $15K in a motor, what's $5.00 / gal for gas.

Nitrous

100 bucks a fill up if you got a 20 gal tank, at approx 6 MPG :o
08-04-2004, 07:32 PM
Swifster

Quote:

Originally posted by Matt167
100 bucks a fill up if you got a 20 gal tank, at approx 6 MPG :o

Matt, if $15K can be invested in just the engine of a toy, $5 for a gallon won't be a problem.
08-04-2004, 07:41 PM
Matt167

Quote:

Originally posted by Swifster
Matt, if $15K can be invested in just the engine of a toy, $5 for a gallon won't be a problem.

Would if most all the money ya had went into the motor and almost none for gas but, I'd have to agree with ya:)
08-04-2004, 10:19 PM
Oldf100fordman

How about aluminum heads? They allow even 10.5 or so to 1 compression without detination. Cast Iron hot spots are one of the leading causes of detination.
08-05-2004, 05:44 AM
brickman

Thanks Guys, I have hope. It's not the money but the desire to have that built engine that I desire, despite being told I can't! I get enough of that anymore!:D

So Octane booster with a good ignition should be enough for my 10:0 to 1 compression plans, right?

I may look further into the Toluene too, I have heard something about that before. Anybody out there ever use it them selves?
08-05-2004, 09:42 AM
Henry Rifle

Brickman,

I agree with Richard. Octane booster isn't worth the money. There are magazine articles all over the place that tell you how to get mega-HP on 93 octane gas. It just takes cubic inches and the right combination of parts.

I built a killer 454 with a little over 9:1 compression, Comp Cams 305H Magnum cam, stock oval port closed chamber heads, hyper-eutectic pistons, Holley 780 DP, dual plane manifold, Mallory Unilite, long-tube headers and a good balance job. Hooked it to a toploader in an A-bone sedan, and it would flat move. Low 12's on street tires with closed exhaust.

It's in the parts, man . . . it's in the parts.
08-08-2004, 04:06 PM
brickman

I believe that I am starting to get the drift, that simply the old ways of high compression = hp arn't nessecary anymore to get the same end results. I think that I will now work alittle closer with my mechinest.
08-08-2004, 08:06 PM
The F.N.G.

You just have to manage the compression correctly.

Many smaller engines run 10:1 from the factory but the heads and pistons are designed to carefully eliminate any places where pre-ignition can start.

Do a web search on rollerwave pistons and you will find out some really interesting info. Also look up "squish" and quench".

Don't disregard the info if it comes from a "ricer" engine builder's site. The guys with the itty-bitty powerplants are getting huge HP out of them by using technology to its utmost, it's time the "big boys" did likewise.

Abe
08-08-2004, 11:33 PM
drg84

FNG, i have to agree with you to an extent. A lot of the ricer tech is based on computer and turbos. Without this, all you have is 120 HP 4 bangers. Remember, things such as Hemi heads, 4V per cylinder and single plain intakes started on V8s. Their just combined with computer timing and fun things like OHV and aluminum in the rice. We made the technology, they just ran with it.
08-09-2004, 05:09 PM
brickman

As it is well documented, I am not a rice fan, but....good tech is good tech who ever is using it IMHO. I would like to thank everyone that commented here, once again I have had my questions answered.
08-11-2004, 05:56 PM
brickman

Okay guys, here is what I have come up with to sooth my passion for compression. I believe that we have come up with a solution that can use pump gas and still get 400 hp:

early 350 4 bolt block
PBM forged 383 crankshaft 3.75" stroke 350 main
summit reconditioned 5.7" rods with ARP wavelock bolts
K.Black Hyperuetectic flat top 2 valve relief piston for 3.7" stroke with 5.7"rod
Comp Cams 290* - Duration 230* @ .050", 480 lift 109* lobe sep
Hyd. Lifters
400 harmonic balancer
400 flexplate
punched out .060 over
balanced
Ported and polished
Wiend single plain exterminator
Holley 700
Block hugger headers

What do you guys think? Also, what is the best ignition combo I can run with this set-up? I was thinking of upgrading my stock distributor with a MSD 6A kit.
08-11-2004, 06:10 PM
The F.N.G.

It's missing one key component, EFI :)

Carburetors should be used only for historical value.

Abe
08-15-2004, 07:02 PM
brickman

Thats some very good combo's Tech, what an interesting website, I learned some things. I think that with the info I have gotten here, I can get my machinest on the same page with me. Thank you all.
08-16-2004, 03:08 AM
larry0071

A good rule of thimb for compression is that 1 full comp point equals approx 3%. So a 500 HP engine at 10.0:1 should be about 515 HP at 11.0:1 compression. If this 15 hp is worth a life of race fuels or octane boosters than for you it may well be a good way to increase HP a bit. You would make more power I would think in spending some time in your garage trying to smooth out the ports on your heads, or getting the machine work done properly by a reputable shop that cares about thier work. Compression is the cheap and easy way to get that last bit of power, I would try to not use it as my primary power tool :]