Eagle and Scat crankshafts??.

Well I have been looking into the two brand names for a 383 crankshaft.Seems both have have a questionable history.Both,from what I understand,are China imports.Where the Scat is finished machined here in the U.S. and Eagle is finished machined off shore.

Comments I found on other forums about Scat are some are out of round and have stress cracks which result in the cranks breaking on the cast and cast steel ones.

The Eagle's machine work in comments from other forums,I found are very poorly done.Under sized and hard to balance.

So I am looking for your comments on what I think I have found.I am a "do-it-right" the first time kind of guy,but I can't justify buying one of the race forge cranks for my street driven van just to get reliability.I surely am not building a tinker's toy.This is supposed to be a torquer reg gas TBI or EFI 383.

What do you guys know about Howard's crankshafts??.I looked briefly at them on Competition Products.

Was it a matter of early cranks having issues in both brand names that have been resolved??.

Current thinking that I am reading has the Eagle crank as junk, Eagle rods as good. No problem with Scat stuff. David Vizard has published info detailing dyno blasts at or past 550 hp repeatedly with a Scat cast steel 9000 series crank. For anything this side of full competition, I would choose a Scat 9000 crank and Scat Pro Stock I-beam forged rods.
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SCA-25700P/
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SCA-935050/

HOWARDS are machine by Callies i used alot of scats . some cats .some RPMs .some Elings.PBMs. Ohio.eagle and alot of no names the top of the list is Callies Comp star .Scat .PBM for the china 4340 cranks. and there is a top line usa steel? cranks your looking at $1500. and up .the list is long and have used alot of them as well. on the cast steel the scat or PBM is what i have used . for them cracking cast or steel well over power any crank and then not tune the engine right . not use the right damper on it .well its going to crack . i have seen many $2000. cranks with cracks in them it happens. you get what you pay for some of the cheap cranks need to be re ground out of the box .for rods i used every ones. H beams. i stay away from a no name rod bolt . i use the scat has they are weight matched better them some .it can get very hard to take more then 3 grams off a H beam big end and scats are better then that. there is also were they put the counter weigths on the crank they may not be in the right spot and then your looking at much work to get them in to balance . has for them china 4340 i seen one hold up in a 8500+ big chief 565 with alot of NOs still holding

When I built my 383 back in 2001-02, my machine shop handled Eagle products, so I had them order a rotating assembly, and they balanced and checked everything before assembling the short block. Back then, I did not hear about problems with these parts, but I felt better going through a machine shop as they could reject a part if it was flawed.

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Originally Posted by rumrumm

When I built my 383 back in 2001-02, my machine shop handled Eagle products, so I had them order a rotating assembly, and they balanced and checked everything before assembling the short block. Back then, I did not hear about problems with these parts, but I felt better going through a machine shop as they could reject a part if it was flawed.

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That is a very good point having your machine shop check the parts.

I am somewhat spoiled because when we ran as a vendor in swap meets in the mid west,we would have first hand encounters with manufacturers.I was in the loop and knew the inside scoop of speed parts manufacturing.

Last couple of days I have been looking hard at Competition Products catalog and they sell the Scat and Eagle stuff,but make it very clear that those are imported parts.Just wow.Sure makes me think there is something to that.

there is alot more then just them two .others will not tell you were its coming from all rods and cranks like the list i posted. even if it is machine here in the US the steel may not be made here the US . is not a big deal has there not much you can do about it now. i have blocks that are not made in the US or valves springs retainers seals gaskets bearings heads or intake .heads and blocks. dampers .chain sets.ring sets. some of this stuff is better then a like US part . but i like blocks and heads made in the US but seats and valve .spring.titamium may not even be made in the US.i never care for eagle much they had a bad run of parts small bock chevy cranks with under size nose .i allways had the feeling they were trying to pull the wool over some eyes with the name EAGLE that some may think its a made in the USA products its not... one thing about scat is there lower price line is a china casting or forgeing but they make hi rent cranks. alot of shops sell a import line this maybe a eye opener for some but its been going on for some time .95% of my builds use a import crank in them .alot of the time its better then a welded crower or top line crank thats been hurt bad and fixed.or a stock over ground crank that s seen way to many bad times

Have used both Eagle and Scat cranks. Have found that the Eagles will occaionally, have problems with machining. Many times I have found rod and main journals that tapered as much as .0005 from one end to the other. Scat cranks have much better machining and, I have found, are generally speaking a better buy for the buck.

Both of these cranks come out of China.

Good luck with your project. If it was me I'd use the Scat stuff.

In fact I have a Scat rotating assembly in the Cad.:D

I am going to say this out front of this post.Because I am still somewhat a newbie here,I don't like using other forum' ref's because I don't know if I am crossing over a line I shouldn't or I am offending the site management or members using a ref that was a problem in this HOME site's history.Trust me,I consider this as my home site.But because I am looking on the web for scat crankshaft customer comments and feedback from my home site,it limits me to the ref I am about to post.For the interest of the members here and of course for my benefit as well is the only reason for me to continue to ask questions based on what I have found.So that said,please read the ref and then comment on what I discovered.

http://www.speedtalk.com/forum/viewt...bbec9b21951a5e

Trust me again,I am taking the advise given to me from what I consider my main source here.

Oh yeah,if I could only move next door to Pat or Richard..........Hummm,naaa.:D :LOL:

well thats old new s for me as every crank i hand fit use to using std and spilting then with 001 or a x .you must under stand that theres alot more to this then crank size . there housing bore size and . bearing as they are not to a STD size i have check clevitte .kings .speed pros. ACL s and you can set diffrent oil clearance just with the maker of the bearing and from a p bearing to a H .speed talks is ok but some guy got on there crying about a wash it drop it in with std bearings and it did not happen so the scat crank is bad ?i have hand fitted 1600. dollar cranks the same way i split bearing s all the time .thats is why i try to stick with one brand of bearing maker so i know what i going to needed for bearings .but first thing i do is wash the crank and mic it before you balance it and if not happy send it back . i have sent scats/PBM back before .but out of the 5O+ of the china cranks there over all is the best .as for a 350 having 003 on rods and mains thats the big end of spec and i seen that size with a full size crank small spec on all housing bores many times that were i go in and ajust size.were the bearings were STD but under some other spec on the bearing shell . and seen new race bearing stamp wrong and one under size by 0005 thats why every ring and every bearing get check in the housing bore . at the end of the day your building this . my 548 blower engine has a scat crank in it .my 14.8 548 had a scat in it . two other blower engines have a scat in them . a turbo 540 i built has a scat in it .a 8.50 drag car has one and a496 in a pull truck has one and about 20+ more that i done or sold cranks for just with scats

One other thing I am finding is the Scat steel cast 9000 isn't a drop in crank because it isn't balanced very well.That is needs to be checked and most likely needs to balanced again.Any comments??.

Gary

We do those every day and it is common practice to use the under/std/over sized bearings to get the clearance you want.

We have found that the Scat cranks are above the Eagle cranks in spec tolerances.

If you want some prices PM me and I'll have Corey answer you--we have them in stock, also pistons and rods and can ship them to you balanced--

Jerry

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Originally Posted by 1gary

One other thing I am finding is the Scat steel cast 9000 isn't a drop in crank because it isn't balanced very well.That is needs to be checked and most likely needs to balanced again.Any comments??.

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well yes all this needs to be done . they ruff it in they will tell you what the bob weigth will take . but there so many pistons and rods out there it would be hard to buy a crank with the rigth bob weigth . i just did a 556 crank every thing look good till we spun it and i have to put 4 plugs of heavy metal in

hey there is jerry:3dSMILE: jerry you can take over. i am done for the night:3dSMILE::3dSMILE:

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Originally Posted by jerry clayton

Gary

We do those every day and it is common practice to use the under/std/over sized bearings to get the clearance you want.

We have found that the Scat cranks are above the Eagle cranks in spec tolerances.

If you want some prices PM me and I'll have Corey answer you--we have them in stock, also pistons and rods and can ship them to you balanced--

Jerry

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Thanks Jerry.I thought it is just a street stroker.........well that isn't the right answer.We have split bearing the race engines too.Takes about 80hrs of work to get it right(file fit rings and all) and I didn't think I was going to put that kind of effort into this.But I will have the bearings right once I am done.I am getting to like the 7/16's bolt stroker Scat rods through and I am warming up to using the Scat crank which would be the 9000 series or better.If I went with a Scat forged crank,well I only save $100 bucks over a Howards "track smart crank.Hummm.

One thing to sure.The Eagle brand name is no longer in the running from what I have read.As a side note,Eagle better straiten it's act up if they don't want a whole bunch of customer complaint buckshot up it's butt.

Yepper,it never changes with anything,you get exactly what you pay for.

Scat balances to within a "couple" of grams. For most street engines that won't see 6000 RPM they are "usable"??

But I don't waste my money on factory balancing. Buy the raw parts and have a local guy balance them.

ALL engine components should be carefully checked before assembly. Always remember, if in doubt, check it again and then have that local machine shop guy look it over for you.

Or, you could just buy the parts from Jerry and have him do the balance job for you. Then you'll know it's right.

Ever wonder why there's never enough money to do it right......but always enough to do it over????????????????:D

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Originally Posted by Geezer2

Ever wonder why there's never enough money to do it right......but always enough to do it over????????????????:D

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excellant statement :)done that too many times .:CRY:

The bob weight numbers that the crank manufactures list are target bob weights that allow a balance shop to balance an assembly internally without adding heavy metal to the end counterweights------

Now most of them will sell you a balanced assembly, but of course this means that you buy your rods, pistons, rings, bearings from them also---

We also use some Callies cranks that we have them balance to OUR specs for some shelf packages that we stock----keeps them honest!!!!an example is the 414 cid kits for our Dart SHP SBC engines--4.125 bore/3.875 stroke/6.000 rod--and yes the 3.875 stroke is so there is some material in the piston top--

And---the Scat 3.75 crank/6.0 rod packages are good sellers and Corey has several piston confiqs here at all times with what to me seems like a lot of packages coming constantly