help me out!!

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11-18-2006, 01:51 PM
Dave Severson

help me out!!

Ok, have an '82 (or something) Camaro that I took on trade. My significant other wants me to build it for her. Engine has been changed, the casting number on the block is 14101148, Mortec sez it's a one piece rear seal 350. It has the tall lifter bores, so that would make it a roller cam block, right? (Currently has non-roller hydraulic in it).

Well, got to do some go fast stuff, thinking a roller cam, specs unknown (I'm a Ford guy) and a set of 200 cc runner aluminum heads (or thereabouts). The engine has to have good power, and still be very streetable. Can I get away with 10:1 compression, and how much cam will this thing want???? Also have a set of Hooker shorty headers, fairly equal on tube length going into a 2 1/2" 3 bolt flanged collector. Tranny is a 700R4.

Thanks in advance for the help (and yes, I do expect a bit of abuse on this project, too!):LOL: :LOL:
11-18-2006, 02:57 PM
southerner

okay go for a set of flat top pistons, deck the block, to decrease quench. Heads, hmmmm if new a set of edeldock performers matched with their performer camshaft. With the raised camshaft block you will need to probably run the shorter pushrods and to get your valve geometry right. I will have to look into the camshaft specs some more, what revs do you want to run in ? so being a street car I am picking you want to build plenty of torque with it. Right ?
11-18-2006, 03:01 PM
Dave Severson

Yeah, I suppose I should just make it a 383, huh? Still the most cost effective method of getting torque out of a small block chebbie. Far as cam specs, I dunno. I'm a Ford guy. Erik has the details on the heads, maybe he will jump in here later. Like I said, I'm a Ford guy.:LOL: :LOL: :LOL:
11-18-2006, 03:05 PM
Itoldyouso

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Dave, if it looks like the one below, it is a roller engine. The little raised threaded areas are for the lifter retainer to bolt down to.

So your significant other likes speed, huh? Cool.

Don
11-18-2006, 03:08 PM
Dave Severson

Yup, that's what it is. No idea how it ended up with a regular flat tappet hydraulic cam in it.....
11-19-2006, 07:48 AM
erik erikson

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave Severson

Yeah, I suppose I should just make it a 383, huh? Still the most cost effective method of getting torque out of a small block chebbie. Far as cam specs, I dunno. I'm a Ford guy. Erik has the details on the heads, maybe he will jump in here later. Like I said, I'm a Ford guy.:LOL: :LOL: :LOL:

Dave,I would look at some CNC'D heads that have a port volume in the 185-195 area.
You talked about running a roller cam.Mech. or hyd.?
If you think the engine will see 7,000 then I would only look at the mech. roller cams with a small base circle.
To try and cut down on the valve adjustments I would limit the valve lift to .600.
It will save you a few bucks also in the valve spring department also.
In the past 6 or so months I have run a lot more of the Lunati goodies.
I would look at Lunati's VooDoo roller cams.
We have used part number 60133 with very good luck.
This was in a 6 in. rod 383 10.5 to 1 engine with a set of 195cc CNC'D heads,Victor intake,floed 650 double pumper.
The guy had it in a 81 Camaro with a 3,500 stall and a 4.10 gear.
One of the last race's of the season he drove it to the track over 50 miles round trip and bolted on a set of 26 tall slicks.
The car was running 7.10's in 1/8 mile with some tunning.
While this does not sound that quick keep in mind he drove it there on pump gas.
On the nice day's he was driving the car every chance he got.
While the engine was never on the dyno I would guess it made an easy 500 hp.
11-19-2006, 01:47 PM
Dave Severson

Would this be ok with the 700R4 that Van's is setting up? He'd prefer to see me stay in the 400 to 425 horse level.. Maybe just backing off to a vacuum secondary 650 would help with the driveability and make the OD trans live a bit longer???? Got to stick with the mechanical rollers, such cheap horsepower, all things considered.... Gonna go look at the VooDoo specs. I'm sure you (Erik) got a line on just the heads I need?????
11-19-2006, 03:20 PM
erik erikson

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave Severson

Would this be ok with the 700R4 that Van's is setting up? He'd prefer to see me stay in the 400 to 425 horse level.. Maybe just backing off to a vacuum secondary 650 would help with the driveability and make the OD trans live a bit longer???? Got to stick with the mechanical rollers, such cheap horsepower, all things considered.... Gonna go look at the VooDoo specs. I'm sure you (Erik) got a line on just the heads I need?????

Dave,with 400 to 425 hp yo don't need a mech. roller cam.
At this hp level I think you can get it done with a large hyd. or a small mech.
Even a small mech. roller will push you above the 400 level.
Yes,a vac. carb will help out a lot.
At 400 hp you need a 180 cc head to get the job done.
11-19-2006, 03:50 PM
pat mccarthy

a lot of the gm truck came this way . roller block and flat.yes it a roller block i justed did one that came from gm with a flat hyd cam .this is now a roller engine yes the shorter push rod spider for the stock lifters and retaning plate for the roller cam if you go with the small bolt pattern on the top gear for the step nose cam i would use that type of cam and the stock gm roller lifters and the gm retaning plate for the cam and timing set and a set of custom push rod oh do not to forget to run the gm melonized gear for the steel core cam if you use a gm core gm
11-19-2006, 03:51 PM
Dave Severson

K, maybe I'll look at some of the hydraulic and hydraulic rollers, and put all the old hardcore mechanical stuff back in the boxes!!!! Maybe the next one. This one has to be civilized enough to live in traffic, cruising, and some touring.....

Sure do appreciate the advise, now I have to go study up on these 700R-4 trannies to see what I need for goodies in it, and what I can run for gears in the 9"... Heck, you know I had to get some Ford stuff in it sonewheres!!!!:LOL: :LOL:
11-19-2006, 03:57 PM
pat mccarthy

hey dave what is the world coming to you working on a chevy and me on a ford:eek: the world must be ending just took a job in a ford flat head . to re machine and rebuild :3dSMILE:
11-19-2006, 04:00 PM
Dave Severson

Egads!!! And now I own 2 Camaro's!!!! Something must have gone wrong, maybe the whole world jumped a tooth on timing!!!! Next thing ya know I'll be chopping the roof on Uncle Bob's lightweight Mopar!!!!
11-19-2006, 04:06 PM
pat mccarthy

oh well at lest it US steel ? well i know the flat head is. have fun. dave them chevy are not that bad if you can make a ford run . chevys are easy. you can put all them chevy parts in a big box and shake it hard and they go together
11-19-2006, 04:11 PM
southerner

Sure do appreciate the advise, now I have to go study up on these 700R-4 trannies to see what I need for goodies in it, LOL: :LOL:[/QUOTE]

I would look at getting some heavy duty clutch packs and a light shifter kit, pull up some corvette TH 700 codes and specs and compare them to your trannies code and specs, I know that some of the high output corvettes had heavy duty parts in the trans. :D :D
11-19-2006, 04:21 PM
shawnlee28

Here is a good 700 r4 site that list all the parts and prices and different hp levels each part can handle.Looks to be pretty complete on all options.
http://www.transmissionhead.com/
11-19-2006, 05:21 PM
Dave Severson

Thanks Shawn, lots of neat stuff in there. I don't have a clue what most of it is, but I emailed it to the tranny shop. Appreciate the help.
11-19-2006, 05:32 PM
lt1s10

i knew you would see the light.:LOL: she is not gonna like the HD shift kit. :CRY: i didnt anyway. :cool:
11-19-2006, 05:36 PM
Dave Severson

Yeah, I don't know squat about automatics.....Always been a gear banger myself.... Just looked, TCI sells a complete 700R4 with manual or automatic shifting and all the goodies for about $1600. Tranny guy I talked too (he did the 350 in the old race car last year) sez he can do a 700 for about $1200 with the converter that is ok for 450 horse. Guess that must be an ok deal, huh?>?? Turbo Hydro's are a heck of a lot less, but I think I need the overdrive...
11-19-2006, 05:46 PM
lt1s10

1200.00 is a deal, if he'll stand behind it.
11-19-2006, 06:02 PM
Dave Severson

yeah, he's an old racer buddy. No problem there I guess. I'm sure it will cost me a favor or two down the road someday, but that's ok too....
11-20-2006, 07:00 AM
Henry Rifle

Some more reading material, Dave.

http://www.bowtieoverdrives.com/index.shtml

Make sure you have a way to lock the converter in overdrive.
11-20-2006, 07:24 AM
kitz

I'm wary of the 700R4's. You can get a good one or bad one depending on whether the case is warped enough to put the bearings and drive line in a bind. In any case I don't think they hold high HP (>350) very dependably. Check out Project33.com; he had some issues for example, albeit on a more serious engine. My neighbor's son built a 400 SBC with a 'race' built 700R4 that crapped out early and often. I still don't know if he got that resolved. Many other horror stories out there on them!

Kitz
11-20-2006, 08:43 AM
lt1s10

most people that have trouble with the 700r4 trans. don't have the T.V. cable adj. properly. it also helps to drive it in drive below 50 mph, and then put it in overdrive when on the highway. with the cable out of adj you can burn the trans up in no time. thats not the trans fought.:HMMM:
11-20-2006, 01:28 PM
Henry Rifle

The 700R4 and the 4L60E (same trans but computer controlled) have survived behind a lot of high horsepower cars right from the factory. Like Mike said, the problems come from the TV cable - and from the lockup control.

Checking pressures on installation is critical.
11-20-2006, 03:01 PM
Dave Severson

Must be something to the TVR cable thing, My tranny guy sez he won't touch the 700's unless he can install it, do the adjustments, and test drive it himself.... Too bad the SO doesn't just want a 5 speed, so much easier to set up.....
11-20-2006, 05:15 PM
Henry Rifle

Bowtie Overdrives provides a step-by-step set-up instruction, complete with pressure measurements. You go through it one piece at a time, then call them and tell them the results before proceeding further. They run in all their transmissions, and record the pressure data, so if you foul up, they catch it and tell you what to do.

I have about 350 HP in my 93 Vette, 130,000 miles, and the R-4 is still just fine.
11-20-2006, 07:16 PM
lt1s10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave Severson

Must be something to the TVR cable thing, My tranny guy sez he won't touch the 700's unless he can install it, do the adjustments, and test drive it himself.... Too bad the SO doesn't just want a 5 speed, so much easier to set up.....

once you get it in and adj. right, you'll love the overdrive. :cool:
11-20-2006, 09:24 PM
billlsbird

......Hey Dave, gee whiz this is different! I'M answering your post instead of YOU answering mine! .... The only thing that i would be concerned with is the 700R4. I read where other posters said some bad/some good things about them but I'd like to add that I wouldn't use on again. I had an '84 Camaro, 2800 lbs, 400 small block, 438 HP @ 5250 RPM's, 499 Ft. Lb's @ 4000 RPM's... I had Art Carr {the old Art Carr, before he sold his buisness. Around 1993 or so} build my 700R4 with all the heavy duty parts, high dollar Tq. converter, trans cooler, etc. And professional install... Well it blew up..... I took it back & traded it for a Turbo 400, sure the OD is great but beware of abusing it with too much HP..... Also AFR has a new small block street head out that is supposed to be really nice..... hope this helps ya, Bill
11-21-2006, 03:46 AM
Dave Severson

Thanks for all the input guys. Maybe I'll just hold off on the trannie til the engine is done, run on the dyno, and the horsepower and torque is a known commodity then decide.. Guess I'd rather do without the OD then do without the horsepower.....
11-21-2006, 09:09 AM
shawnlee28

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This is the transmission that couldn't be built until now, because the parts weren't available. As the 700R4 transmission becomes more and more popular, stronger parts come on the market. This transmission has every heavy duty / high performance part on the market plus all of the tricks we've learned in our twelve years of building high performance / heavy duty 700R4 transmissions. This is the strongest 700R4 transmission that can be built bar-none. If it doesn't have it, it can be added as an extra. Here are some of the parts that come as standard on the 700 Mega Raptor. You get everything that comes with the 700 Raptor plus the Torque Drive Package, Torque Master Package and the five pinion OEM GM planet gears. This transmission is good for any type of heavy duty / performance use up to 700 horse power / 700 foot pounds of torque using pump gasoline, 4WD, towing, street rods, drag racing, big block, one tons and others. See ratings chart below.
11-21-2006, 02:39 PM
thesals

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave Severson

Egads!!! And now I own 2 Camaro's!!!! Something must have gone wrong, maybe the whole world jumped a tooth on timing!!!! Next thing ya know I'll be chopping the roof on Uncle Bob's lightweight Mopar!!!!

it must have already jumped.... I just started dropping an original shelby 289 in a 61 rambler yesterday