Crankshalf Barings and Rod barings

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Originally posted by lt1s10
you really don't know what the stuff is or what its used for do you? my dad and brother used it in the 40's to check bearings in the old Babbitt bearing motors, where you shimmed the bearing cap to make them fit,(you've probably never did that either) and a 10,000.00 pair of mic. wouldn't have done you no good, if the shaft is in the motor, in the car, I'm not gonna pull it out just so I can get a mic. to it just to check it.

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I owe you an apology and a few others.I talked to my Father who is 75 and he says that this was a common practice with shimming the bearing caps.I also talked to one of the older retired shop owners who is in also in his early 70's and he said the same thing.After talking to both of these older guys I have learned something "there is more than one way to skin a cat"With that being said I can see where plasti-gauge might be acceptable in some cases.I will try and be more understanding of all the older mechanics,engine builders,machinist's etc.After all some of you where building engines way before I was even born.

Way to go Erik, takes a good man to offer an apology.......Besides, I was beginning to think I was the only fool that set there with a set of Mic's (mine are Starrets) and tunes oil clearances......Do you check the cam bores too?????? Or am I the only one that bored????

What do you guys think on "H" bearings, tighter, looser, or the same?????

ummmmm. What did I do now????? Nope, guess I don't get it...............

he should apologize, he is wrong, and if you want to take up for him then that's your prerogative, but it don't make it right. he should have went home and asked his daddy before he shot off at the mouth to start with, and you should be ashamed for condoning it.

ok, I'm wrong, Erik's wrong. we're both idiots........but I'm a happy idiot!!!!

Wow. It took two pages to determine that one might determine whether a crank had been turned by using plastigage . . . and ended up as an ass-kicking contest. If this wasn't so silly, it would be funny.

i will not :p i had this pissing contest be for with mike and denny on plastigage dos it work? yes it dose. BUT when you need numbers. you need a bore gauges and a micrometer .when i do a rod bore or a cylinder wall or a sleeve in a block i use a mic.s and a bore gauge. the bore gauge get set off the mic.s so them are real numers .yes i know my mic.s may not read. like my crank grinders? BUT they have standards with the mike.s and show how bored i am i have check my mic.s with his :HMMM: for a long time i did not want to send engines out with numbers on them mainly oil running clearances. but i did people like to see this so i get a call from a guy .here we go i am thinking .said he now is the new owner of a 565 big block and had the paper work on it . this was not runned and would like to talk to me on my numbers? i had on the paper?? i had all the numbers down and he got the same ones to the tenth just like the paper i sent out with the engine . and he said he .wanted to know who the hell i was. said he never sene this to much . for this i did get more work .so my mic.s and bore gauge paid off:LOL:

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Originally posted by pat mccarthy
i will not :p i had this pissing contest be for with mike and denny on plastigage dos it work? yes it dose. BUT when you need numbers. you need a bore gauges and a micrometer .when i do a rod bore or a cylinder wall or a sleeve in a block i use a mic.s and a bore gauge. the bore gauge get set off the mic.s so them are real numers .yes i know my mic.s may not read. like my crank grinders? BUT they have standards with the mike.s and show how bored i am i have check my mic.s with his :HMMM: for a long time i did not want to send engines out with numbers on them mainly oil running clearances. but i did people like to see this so i get a call from a guy .here we go i am thing .said he now is the new owner of a 565 big block and had the paper work on it . this was not runned and would like to talk to me on my numbers? i had on the paper?? i had all the numbers down and he got the same ones to the tenth just like the paper i sent out with the engine . and he said he .wanted to know who the hell i was. said he never sene this to much . for this i did get more work .so my mic.s and bore gauge paid off:LOL:

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pat, read the ? and read my answer. and then read the next post. it was unnessary and uncalled for. i can read mic.

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Originally posted by lt1s10
pat, read the ? and read my answer. and then read the next post. it was unnessary and uncalled for. i can read mic.

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It was a generalization.It was not directed at you personally.If it was I would have used your name in a sentence.Again, I am sorry.

i never said it did not work? for a $1.50 it will give you some thing . i said some guys when they pay for a engine build they want you to use a bore gauges mic.. and will not say any thing more on this. i can not sell a job using plastigage:HMMM:

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Originally posted by pat mccarthy
i never said it did not work? for a $1.50 it will give you some thing . i said some guys when they pay for a engine build they want you to use a bore gauges mic.. and will not say any thing more on this. i can not sell a job using plastigage:HMMM:

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Pat,that was the point I was trying to make on page 5.No one really got what I was trying to say.

i did i am not trying to piss off mike or denny BUT i will not say i am a idiot . i am stating fact that NO one will send me any work if i used plastigage . in this town i would have no work.

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Originally posted by Dave Severson
Way to go Erik, takes a good man to offer an apology.......Besides, I was beginning to think I was the only fool that set there with a set of Mic's (mine are Starrets) and tunes oil clearances......Do you check the cam bores too?????? Or am I the only one that bored????

What do you guys think on "H" bearings, tighter, looser, or the same?????

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With me it really depends more on the application.This is what has worked for me on hi-compression hi-rpm circle track engines.With "H" series bearings.On the 2.1 dia rods I use 1.2 x 2.1 = 2.52,on the mains which are 2.45 dia. we use 1.3 x 2.45 which gives 3.185.This has worked very well for us the past 3 seasons.We use to use .001 per inch of bearing dia. and we started having bearing issues after about 10 nights.Now we get 15 nights on the I.M.C.A. engines before we touch them.We check them if we see any strange wear problems on the cam bearings or see any start to spin.In the U.S.M.T.S engine we will watch this more because of the extra r.p.m.'s and the extra spring pressure used with the roller cam.Don't worry Dave,Pat I also uses them.

Wait until the end to reply? I posted on the first page:

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The original question was "how can I tell if my crank was turned?" He didn't ask how to build a precision racing motor.

Within normal temperature ranges, plastigage will not vary enough to make a difference. It is more than accurate enough to make that judgement. If the crank is ground, it will be .010, .020, or 0.30. You don't need an inside mic to figure that out.

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It is for people who don't know how to read an inside bore gauge or mic.
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Eric,

If you read that again, you might see why someone would think you were putting them down with that statement. Just a thought.

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The original inquiry got lost in an argument over whether plastigage or mics were superior - which had absolutely nothing to do with the original question. To determine whether a crank is either .002 or .010, plastigage will do fine. An inside mic will do fine too. In THIS PARTICULAR SITUATION, either would work, depending on what you have available. However, plastigage was the quick and easy for the the guy to find out. My last point was that people got so tied up in who was "right" that they lost sight of the original question. That is now painfully obvious. If you re-read my post, you will see that I tried to calm the "discussion" down. That was a rousing success, wasn't it? Sometimes someone asks us what time it is, and we end up telling him how to build a clock. Then we end up arguing whether quartz or jeweled movements are better. Worse, we end up throwing the clocks at each other and stomping off to our rooms. Absofreakinglutely amazing.

ok henry i like jeweled:whacked: i am trying hard to fit in here i guess it is not working :( i sometimes think mike and denny are right on and i think i know what erick is trying to say i did not see this post at first .cant we all get along or is it me:confused:

[QUOTE]Originally posted by erik erikson
With me it really depends more on the application.This what has worked for me on hi-compression hi-rpm circle track engines.With "H" series bearings.On the 2.1 dia rods I use 1.2 x 2.1 = 2.52,on the mains which are 2.45 dia. we use 1.3 x 2.45 which gives 3.185.This has worked very well for us the past 3 seasons.We use to use .001 per inch of bearing dia. and we started having bearing issues after about 10 nights.Now we get 15 nights on the I.M.C.A. engines before we touch them.We check them if we see any strange wear problems on the cam bearings or see any start to spin.In the U.S.M.T.S engine we will watch this more because of the extra r.p.m.'s and the extra spring pressure used with the roller cam.Don't worry Dave,Pat also uses them. [/QUOTE

Were the bearing issues from heat?? I've been opening up the mains on the last few Windsors, new one will use the bigger mains, forget the size right off but it's same mains as a 351C. On some C motors we went high as high as 3. I'll get back with you on the particulars when I get the block details worked out, going to use a Dart, maybe aluminum?????

Should I open up the cambeaings with the mechanical roller??? Never have played much with them....Mostly just checked the size and make sure it's within spec...... Good tip, thanks

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Originally posted by pat mccarthy
ok henry i like jeweled:whacked:

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:LOL: :LOL: :LOL: Oh yeah????? Well I'm old, I like wind up pocket watches!!!!!**) **) **)

I'm using a sundial from now on.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Dave Severson

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Originally posted by erik erikson
With me it really depends more on the application.This what has worked for me on hi-compression hi-rpm circle track engines.With "H" series bearings.On the 2.1 dia rods I use 1.2 x 2.1 = 2.52,on the mains which are 2.45 dia. we use 1.3 x 2.45 which gives 3.185.This has worked very well for us the past 3 seasons.We use to use .001 per inch of bearing dia. and we started having bearing issues after about 10 nights.Now we get 15 nights on the I.M.C.A. engines before we touch them.We check them if we see any strange wear problems on the cam bearings or see any start to spin.In the U.S.M.T.S engine we will watch this more because of the extra r.p.m.'s and the extra spring pressure used with the roller cam.Don't worry Dave,Pat also uses them. [/QUOTE

Were the bearing issues from heat?? I've been opening up the mains on the last few Windsors, new one will use the bigger mains, forget the size right off but it's same mains as a 351C. On some C motors we went high as high as 3. I'll get back with you on the particulars when I get the block details worked out, going to use a Dart, maybe aluminum?????

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We where told by our oil manufacture we could close the clearence back up because of our synthetic additive we where useing.Yes, it was the heat of the summer and the rings where a little on the loose side which we think let more metanhol wash down the cyinders and into the oil pan.

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Originally posted by pat mccarthy
ok henry i like jeweled:whacked:

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Pat,would that be a Rolex ?

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Originally posted by erik erikson
We where told by our oil manufacture we could close the clearence back up because of our synthetic additive we where useing.Yes, it was the heat of the summer and the rings where a little on the loose side which we think let more metanhol wash down the cyinders and into the oil pan.

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Methanol will definitely wash the cylinders and cook some bearings!!! Used to run the rings in the sprinter engines tight and the bearings to manufacturers spec and ran on Mobil 1. Never had much for bearing problems...

Everytime I get my "package" figured out for the Ranchero engine I keep running across new trick goodies I like, then have to go back and make everything else match. The really scary thing is going to be the cam!!!!

:LOL: :LOL: boy i wish .on the h bearings that is damn close to the same way i run them and had very good luck .001 pre of inch journal on something that get hammered on hard i will allways open them up a bit more i am big on hi crush on my mains and rods

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Originally posted by Henry Rifle
I'm using a sundial from now on.

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I have a moondial stop watch, used to use if for timing laps in night races with the sprinter.....

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Originally posted by Dave Severson
I have a moondial stop watch, used to use if for timing laps in night races with the sprinter.....

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Oh,stop some people might think that is true.:LOL:

I've heard some of the chebbie guys are timing their stuff with a calender!!!!!:LOL: :LOL:

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Originally posted by Dave Severson
I've heard some of the chebbie guys are timing their stuff with a calender!!!!!:LOL: :LOL:

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They are using the calander to record all their wins!! :LOL:

hey slow down you guys so i can keep up:LOL:

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Originally posted by pat mccarthy
hey slow down you guys so i can keep up:LOL:

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O.K.:LOL:

hey dave be nice on the chevys i did not say any thing about fords

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Originally posted by pat mccarthy
hey dave be nice on the chevys i did not say any thing about fords

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:whacked: :whacked: Just getting tuned up for the CHR Shootout, Pat!!!!! Ya know we are going to have to have one someday, aren't we????????

hey dave i was a ford man had a 34 ford truck with a 400 M in it and a c6 i built in my room when i was 14 years old wish i had that truck was chopped :CRY:

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Originally posted by Dave Severson
:whacked: :whacked: Just getting tuned up for the CHR Shootout, Pat!!!!! Ya know we are going to have to have one someday, aren't we????????

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you bet i will be in the wheel chair with the 656 donovan in it :LOL:

Kewl, I nominate Pat to head the CHR Shootout planning comittee. My vote would go for early summer, 2008 someplace in the middle of the country. Some place with a good drag strip. Never know, plan something a couple years in advance maybe a lot of people could work it into their vacation schedule????????

:HMMM: need to work harder need a trailer to haul the car if any thing sit down with you and erick and have a beer or soda pop that would be cool

Well, definitely something to think about for someday. Sure would be a blast!!!!

that it would**)

I'll be the one poppin' the tops with a mic and sippin' through a plastigage sleeve.

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Originally posted by oldman2
I'll be the one poppin' the tops with a mic and sippin' through a plastigage sleeve.

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I don't think we would even let you touch any measuring equipment.:whacked: :whacked: :LOL: :LOL:

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Originally posted by erik erikson
I don't think we would even let you touch any measuring equipment.:whacked: :whacked: :LOL: :LOL:

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Heck, I'd even give you a yard stick to stir the grog bowl.!!!!!

Denny said he quite yesterday and I told him I was gonna Waite until today to see if I felt dif, before I quite, this is a good example how a forum gets taken over by a few people. there was 2 answers to this thread , but a few people didn't know that or didn't care so they chose to railroad the other answer off of the thread. all I can say is I'm sure you can do without me, but everybody(that had anything to do with Denny leaving) put everything of what you all know together and it wouldn't amount to a drop of what denny knows about the over all working of a car. he is the hardest worker on this forum, and if you think you can replace him you're wrong. I feel like I got him in this mess so I gonna stick with him now. one last thing, Dave, if you gonna eliminate dumb ass post off of a thread, then you need to eliminate the smart ass post also, its been nice knowing and talking to most of you, and wish it didn't come to this, but you have my address if you think I might can help in some way. later, mike