Dart vs World vs 041/186...

Hi, I have a head question. Up til now I had 041 GM heads installed in my van's 350. They worked OK, but one is cracked.
Now I'm thinking about new heads. I want good swirl and low end torque and I'm looking for high quality closed chamber 64cc-67cc heads with around 170cc intake runners.. I've been reading quite a few books, and most of them say 041 or 186 are the best "cheap" heads to get. I've also heard that the Dart Iron Eagle and World Products S/R Torquers are much better than the 041s.
What heads would you suggest for a heavy vehicle that wants good mileage at high compression (10:1)?
Thanks a lot,
Max

Iron Eagles have the newer combustion chamber design which will make them a better head than the SR Torquers which have an older style chamber design similar to your 041 heads. I would recommend the Iron Eagles.

I found a place online that has a Dart Iron Eagle SS that they must modify, because it isn't in Dart's liturature. It has the 170cc runners, with 2.02/1.60 valves. I bought the 76cc chambers but they also have them in 67cc.

http://performanceauto.us/store/inde...42fefdbbb8493c

DART ROCKS:D

Dart makes World Products. They are the same company. The World Products are a little cheaper and may be a little diifferent but they are made by Dart. I just picked up some S/R Torquer heads for my 350. I haven't fired it up yet though so I can't tell you how they run.

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Originally posted by richmondb
Dart makes World Products. They are the same company. The World Products are a little cheaper and may be a little diifferent but they are made by Dart. I just picked up some S/R Torquer heads for my 350. I haven't fired it up yet though so I can't tell you how they run.

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WHAT?? DOES DICK MASKIN KNOW THIS??HOW ABOUT BILL MITCHELL???.WHY DO THEY HAVE DIFFERENT ADDRESS'S THEN?WOW!!!!

i have alumimun dart heads on the 350 i bought, i'm not sure what the specifics are yet but i bet they make a whole mess'a power........

Yeah sounds like Dart's the way to go, but they are a good deal more expensive than the World heads (800 against 600 bucks including freight). And I've heard that Dart and World are affiliated somehow, but that doesn't mean the heads are the same or even similar. The chamber shape and swirl is better on the Dart (from what I've heard), but I wanted to know how much difference there is and how much difference will I feel in terms of torque and mileage as opposed to 186s or 041s or 192s or 601s (which are basically all the same), which I can have for 300 bucks a pair reconed...
Thanks for all the input,
Max

PS: Ebay#: 8014874656
What do you think about these heads? They seem to have goodish chambers and they're 58cc, so with a .100 D-dish I should get 10:1 CR, which is what I'm aiming for. looks like I'll get a good quench area and the valves are nicely deshrouded... PLEASE DON'T BID ON THESE HEADS, THEY'RE MINE :mad: :D

Find out what casting number they are. Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't 58cc iron heads for a 305? I know some Corvette aluminum heads have 58cc chambers, but iron heads? I don't think you will want 305 castings on a 350.

Wow, I guess I could be wrong about them being the same company. I was told they were by a salesman at Summit. They sell both brands. Sorry if I passed along bogus information. Thanks for the correction Erik, I guess I'm not "in the know" like you oh great one.

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Originally posted by richmondb
Wow, I guess I could be wrong about them being the same company. I was told they were by a salesman at Summit. They sell both brands. Sorry if I passed along bogus information. Thanks for the correction Erik, I guess I'm not "in the know" like you oh great one.

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at one time this was rigth but someone got in a pissing constest and they bill michell world and maskins dart went there ways .pbm makes a good looking head and a good prices to. there head saids iron eagle on them on the inside

They're 601 castings, from a 305. The chamber seems to be a good shape; would the overlap at the base (because of the smaller bore on the 305) cause any problems? I thought maybe combined with D-dish pistons I would get a good quench area and the thinner chamber at ignition time round the edges would decrease the chance of detonation. But that's just what I figured out. What other problems are there when you put 305 heads on a 350? Except for too high compression? Slowly I'm getting nearer where I want to be, thanks a lot for all your help,
Max

The small intake and exhaust ports on 305 heads won't allow a 350 to breathe enough air to take advantage of the added displacement. If you were building something other than a performance engine that would normally not see over 4000 rpm, then it would not matter so much. But heads are where the hp and torque comes from in a performance engine, and you want to match the heads, cam, pistons, and induction system for optimal performance. 305 heads are simply a mismatch. Now if you were talking about building a hot 283, that would be different. I'd say go for them.

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Originally posted by pat mccarthy
at one time this was rigth but someone got in a pissing constest and they bill michell world and maskins dart went there ways .pbm makes a good looking head and a good prices to. there head saids iron eagle on them on the inside

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THANKS PAT.MAYBE WE SHOULD CALL YOU THE GREAT ONE.I REALLY DON'T NEED THE HONOR.L.O.L.

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Originally posted by erik erikson
THANKS PAT.MAYBE WE SHOULD CALL YOU THE GREAT ONE.I REALLY DON'T NEED THE HONOR.L.O.L.

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no thanks you can have it. the story came from a good source of what had happen .but i will keep the story to my self. i think both michell and maskin . know some things i do not have a dog in this hunt:whacked:

Quote:

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Originally posted by pat mccarthy
no thanks you can have it. the story came from a good source of what had happen .but i will keep the story to my self. i think both michell and maskin . know some things i do not have a dog in this hunt:whacked:

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FAIR ENOUGH.

The guy you need to ask is named Chris, and he posts as

Fast355 (on Thirdgen.org )

http://thirdgen.org/techbb2/forumdisplay.php?forumid=17

and as

Fast 305 (on FullSizeChevy )

http://www.fullsizechevy.com/forums/...splay.php?f=12

He owns a G20 van that has a lot of work done to it, including custom EPROM chips for the ECM, and several different flavors of engine & head swaps. The heads were ported, and he's done 601s, 416s, 081, 193 among many others.

My questions would be:

Is this for your G20 van? It's big & heavy, so spending a ton of money on heads to flow maximally at high rpm is the wrong way to go. You need great torque especially at mid engine speeds, so ported stock heads might be a better choice IF you can DIY.

How much are you planning to spend, and are you willing to do-it-yourself (DIY)? Most people prefer the budget approach, especially for a street-driven car/truck, because you aren't modifying a race car.

No matter what the answers are (you don't need to answer them here), Chris is the guy to ask because he's probably already done all of what you are thinking about trying and he owns the same van (G20). HTH.

I have a question about my world products heads. What size temperature sensor do I get to fill the hole in between the exhaust outlets and where can I get it from. The instructions say it takes a 3/8 NPT sensor but I ordered one and it is too small. Both heads have a hole for a sensor. Do I just get a plug for the other one?

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Originally posted by richmondb
I have a question about my world products heads. What size temperature sensor do I get to fill the hole in between the exhaust outlets and where can I get it from. The instructions say it takes a 3/8 NPT sensor but I ordered one and it is too small. Both heads have a hole for a sensor. Do I just get a plug for the other one?

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YOU COULD PLUG BOTH OF THEM AND JUST GO OFF THE INTAKE.

Your temperature reading will be more accurage if you use a sensor in the intake manifold.