A 600 cfm carb. will work if you plan on turning the engine above 7,000 rpm's.Quote:
Originally Posted by gassersrule_196
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A 600 cfm carb. will work if you plan on turning the engine above 7,000 rpm's.Quote:
Originally Posted by gassersrule_196
are you sure?
depends on the compression, our old 301 had 11:1's and the 600 worked fine it ran 13.1 all day long every weekend. ive done that cfm calculation and i belive mine came out to 654.7 but i had a 650 on there and it didnt work for nothing. put the 750 on there runs good, just a matter of dialing in the air-bleeeds for the weather now. <well when the tracks open :LOL: bout 3-5 inches of snow here now <barfs>
Copression has nothing to do with picking a carb.Quote:
Originally Posted by gassersrule_196
The old CID X MAX. RPM'S DIVIDE BY 3456 still works great.
Quote:
Originally Posted by gassersrule_196
Geez Scooter, never took you for a lightweight!!!! Get them new studded drag slicks and get out there and do some bracket racing.!!!! Not too much longer around home here and the lakes will all be frozed good and solid so I can go out and practice my uncontrollable slides across the ice. Just getting ready for Bonneville, ya know!!!!!:LOL: :LOL: :LOL: :LOL:
I think the Dual Quad WFCBs had a rating of 385 CFM each. I run a pair on the street.Quote:
Originally Posted by NTFDAY
Bob
We have over heading,over caming,here is an example of carburetors that are to large for an application.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob W
A pair of 385's will flow enough air for a 327 that turns 8,100 rpm's.
Maybe, but that's what Chevy used on the 1956 to 1961 265s and 283 dual fours. In stock trim they allways run a little rich.Quote:
Originally Posted by erik erikson
And a mildly built 265 will do the same thing. Been there done that and long before you were born.Quote:
Originally Posted by erik erikson
Good,someone else that knows something of air flow.Quote:
Originally Posted by NTFDAY
It's a shame that you weren't around in the early to mid '50's, you could have been a great influence to Duntov and the Chevrolet engineers. **)Quote:
Originally Posted by erik erikson
Your sarcasm is great.Quote:
Originally Posted by NTFDAY
When do you take your act on the road?
What exactly is your point?
We have established you are old enough to be my father.
I have listed to a few of you older guys bable about the past,
make up complete BS stories in order to impress one and other.
I was born at night but not last night.
I have worked with performance engines for about the last 15+ years.
It pays my mortage and lets me live very well.
Quote:
Originally Posted by erik erikson
I wouldn't call it "BS Stories".
I still have my 283 race engine in the garage and I still drive my Dual Quad 57 Corvette .
I don't know much but I do know 283s and 265s. I learned alot racing Stock Classes at the drags when you had to use basicaly a stock bodied car and all the stuff to make it an assembly line looking car..
It never ceases to amaze me that when a position becomes untenable attacks on integrity are shortly forthcoming.Quote:
Originally Posted by erik erikson
well then i better go tell the guy who has a 1050 dominator on his 350 hes wrong. car runs 10's but wait 1050 is impossible on a 350 isnt it? i helped assemble his new rear and front suspension he took a 301 out and put a 13-5-1 compression 350 in it with a 1050. the last 15 years? thats to new to know what were talking about :LOL: 350iszed i say!
Nobody said a 1050 wouldn't work. However comparing an all out drag car and it's carb requirements (or what you can get away with with a bunch of tuning) with the recomendation for correct carb sizing on a street machine is comparing apples to oranges..... If the old carb setups, like the dual quads on 327's and tri-powers on big blocks were still the hot set up, then that's what the aftermarket manufacturers would still be peddling... Just because it was the hot set up in '62 doesn't mean it is the hot set up today.... Yeah, it still works. Big deal.Quote:
Originally Posted by gassersrule_196
Duntov and the boys did a heck of a job with the technology that was available and the parts they developed. I'm just really glad we aren't stuck with that technology today, a 275 horse small block just isn't that competitive anymore. And of course there are exceptions to that, too. If you think the old setups are still the best then by all means stick with them. Just don't try and of the new technology setups though, the performance improvements would scare the heck out of you!!!!!:LOL: :LOL:
You are comparing apples to oranges.Quote:
Originally Posted by gassersrule_196
Why not call Holley,Barry Grant etc. and ask them for a carburetor recommendation?
350 you say.
To use all of the 1050 cfm carb the engine would need to be turned to 10,300.All I can say is WOW!!!
Do your self a favor and call someone who knows carbs. if you don't believe me.
Everyones wrong:LOL: the proper size for a race carb is one that gets the vaccume to less than 1 at wot,ideally you want almost 0 vac at wot .If you punch it to the floor and have 2in vac then you are not up to potential.:p
Ahhh,very interesting.Quote:
Originally Posted by shawnlee28
erik, you are talking about building a few motors, to suite your need. they are expensive and don't work well for the masses. GM and ford built some strong motors over the yrs, sold them to the masses, good h.p., reasonable priced, decent gas mileage and up to 6,000 rpm, they stayed together. you cant compare that to a motor you might build in your shop. **) you don't have to meet no smog rules either. :cool: most any good machine shop can build a better motor than GM, but they can't build millions of them, better than GM can.:HMMM: :D
This is true.Quote:
Originally Posted by lt1s10
Roger ,exactly what denny said.Quote:
Originally Posted by DennyW
And many would twist past 6 grand with stock components and stay together.Quote:
Originally Posted by lt1s10
Yes,a few of them went past 6 grand.But I wonder how many where still making hp?:)Quote:
Originally Posted by NTFDAY
Back to the new tech vs. old tech. Before the days of flow benches and dyno's more readily available, the only thing we new was build them light and wind them tight. Spent years making my small blocks go 8,000 RPM, and making the ports and runners bigger.... First time I put it on a dyno I was amazed at how poor it was. Same engine today uses flowed heads with CNC porting, roller cam, shifts at 6500 and makes more power and torque then the old tech 8,000 RPM engines did.....
As Erik said, found out I was all done making power at a much lower RPM, the flow bench showed me I was putting way more flow into the cylinder then it could possibly use.
As long as the comparison is between apples and oranges, the comparison is worthless and the argument is hopeless.......
I couldn't agree more with that Dave, but it still doesn't diminish what was done in the past. If that was the case why would anyone even consider building a Flatty? Cubic inches is not necessarily the answer either. I was much impressed by the 4 banger ricers that were dipping in the mid 6's at Topeka last memorial day weekend. I don't like them , but you have to respect their talent. One other thought. When NHRA was running Pro Stock Truck it was my understanding that they were limited to 350ci and they surely weren't running 650cfm carbs.
They did run two 4 barrel carbs.Quote:
Originally Posted by NTFDAY
well considering it was 13:5-1 compression i guarantee you it wouldnt run 10's on a 650 carb!!!!! and no it didnt go to 10 grand. it was built as a back up motor for a junior fueler!!!!!!! but what the hell do i know i only have proof in my garage :rolleyes:
Is a "junior fueler" a "top fuel" car that runs on gas or a "junior dragster" that had a "Briggs" engine in it and now has a sbc????Quote:
Originally Posted by gassersrule_196
Is that NHRA, or IHRA??
A"fueler" referes to a "Top Fuel" dragster that runs on nitro methane.
But what the hell do I know??? L.O.L.
And I don't have one sitting in my garage.
I use to have a rail draster with a BBC in it.
and on the contrary, there are bunches of circle burners restricted to a 500 CFM 2 barrell carb, some on gas some on methanol, that make some very tall horsepower numbers and spin to 7500 RPM twice every lap.... Lots of ways to improve the efficiency (therefore power) of an engine without simply adding cubic CFM of carburators...... Not so much how much flow is going into the engine, but what's done with it once it gets there..... Drag engines are easy to carb, they don't have to idle below 1,000, don't have to accellerate hard off the corners, and don't have to be "clean" at anything less then wide open throttle....... Streetable engines on the other hand seldom see more then an occasional burst at WOT. low and mid range RPM and good power becomes far more important then flowing a ton of air at 8500 RPM briefly as it crosses the 1/4 mile line.Quote:
Originally Posted by NTFDAY
What works on the dragstrip in a light weight, straight line only, always with the pedal on the floor car isn't even close to what works on the street, oval track, or road course..... I've seen a bunch of drag cars improve their performance when they put the Dominator's on the shelf and run a more correctly sized carb for their application......
you dont know what a junior fueler is? :LOL: i am talking about the little nitro or alkie injected front engine dragsters in the 60's they mainly relied on 301's as their motors, now its 355's and hemis and stuff. since nhra doesnt have that class nor ihra it has been relagated to the goodguys racing assoc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by erik erikson
the 302 chevy:toocool:
Yes,I will agree with you on this.Quote:
Originally Posted by gassersrule_196
The Junior Fuel Eliminator cars run on injected alcohol and the don't use a carburetor.Quote:
Originally Posted by gassersrule_196
Better check the old Good Guys rule book on this one.
:eek: we agreed on something wow. and int he 60's when jr, fuel was in the nhra they ran injected nitro cars, now they run injected alkie.Quote:
Originally Posted by erik erikson
Yes,now we are on the same page of paper.Quote:
Originally Posted by gassersrule_196
i used to work at a bodyshop the guy who ran it his dad used to run a jr fueler in socal in the 60's great stories thats for sure.
:EEK: :EEK: wow we agreed again i dunno if my heart can take this :LOL:
May our trend continue on.L.O.L.Quote:
Originally Posted by gassersrule_196
:LOL: yeah i guess?