Thread: 454 build advice

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I have a 1992 Caprice Wagon (I know not a normal Hot Rodder car), I'm putting a 454 that came from a 71 Chevelle, it has a two-bolt main, was bored .30 over. The guy I got it from said the block had been honed and hot tanked. I will take it to my machine shop guy to verify things. I have an Edelbrock TR2X tunnel ram for dual carbs, which I plan on using Holley 650's. I have read that would be a good carb combo to use. I'm in the process of putting together the parts for the engine build, heads (it came with 396 cast iron heads, but I'll go with aftermarket aluminum heads). I have a TH400 for it. I plan to get a 3000 stall TQ converter. The rear is going to a shop to put in a posi, 373's, and new axels. I will go with an HEI ignition, not sure which one yet. Of course, I’ll have headers, still researching which one I can use for the car.

My goals for the car will be mainly a weekend street cruiser. I will take it to the drag strip once or twice a year to run it, but I’m not trying to have the fastest car, just for fun. The tunnel ram came with the engine. In researching, I have read there are much better intakes for power then a tunnel ram. I like the old school muscle a tunnel ram gives, as I’m older myself. My first plan was to go the blower route, but I like the tunnel ram idea, plus with the block being a two-bolt I was told that I need a four-bolt for boost and a blower setup is pretty expensive.

I called Summit, told the guy my goals for the car and what I already have and he gave me the below listing for parts to build it:

COMP Cams 1828-16 - COMP Cams Ultra Pro Magnum XD Roller Rocker Arms
COMP Cams CL11-602-8 - COMP Cams Thumpr Retrofit Hydraulic Roller Cam and Lifter Kits
Edelbrock 77485 - Edelbrock Victor Jr. 24 Degree Rectangular Port Cylinder Heads for Big Block Chevy
SCAT Engine Components 2-ICR6135 - Scat Pro Stock I-Beam Connecting Rods
SCAT Engine Components 9-10454 - Scat Cast Crankshafts
ICON Performance Pistons IC9919KTM030 - ICON FHR Series Piston and Ring Kits

I did read in another post that the AFR Magnum 265cc BBC heads are the best out there. So, to pick your brains and see if this makes sense for the goals I have for the car.

I don't have the experience to assemble the engine, so once I get a good idea for the parts, I'll take it to my machine shop tech and he will assemble it for me.

Thanks for any advice, tips you guys can give me.

Denny W or Tech Inspector will more than likely chime in on the engine part, listen to their advice and you won't be disappointed.

Thanks! I've read a bunch of posts from Tech Inspector, he sure knows his stuff!

I'll make sure he looks at your post, we've been friends since high school

Welcome to CHR:

Wagons can be cool hot rods - especially when equipped as sleepers that have a lot of get up and go. Your wagon weighs in at 4354 pounds and with a driver and fuel you’ll be pushing 4500 plus pounds so the 454 is a good choice for power. I think the cam that was recommended is a bit too big for any street application. The profile is 2,300 – 6,100 RPM which is way beyond the street if you’re going to stay with the 3.73 rear end. The COMP Cams CL11-600-8 has a 1,700 – 5,500 RPM range which is a lot closer to a boulevard bruiser and it will work much better with the 2.48 low gear ratio of the TH400.

I would also save a bunch of money on the rocker arms and go with the GM stamped steel 1.7 stock ratio. Unless you’re making your living running a ¼ mile roller rockers provide very little in the way of appreciable horsepower.

The TR2X manifold is a high winder and a beast over 6,000 RPM but a real dog at low (read street) RPM. I do not believe the HEI will work with this manifold and I’d be surprised if you stock hood would fit with this setup. Go with an Edelbrock Performer RPM(or similar dual plane manifold from Weiand or Holley) and a race prepped 800CFM Quadrajet or a similar size Holley. I really like the Quadrajet as the primaries are tame but when you hit those massive secondaries the sound is awesome and you catch a glimpse of God smiling down upon you. Holley is a good choice as well – I just really like the Quadrajet and when they’re set up correctly, they are hard to beat.

You need to square your block and put your reciprocating parts together and figure stack for compression before you pick heads (and head gaskets). Hopefully Tech Inspector will chime in with his tutorial on this critical step. Listen to him as he’s written books on this stuff and following his sage advice can save you a lot of heartburn, time and money.

As a suggestion: You mentioned that you’ll have the engine assembled – have you considered talking with your machinist and letting him recommend and provide the parts? Buying a bunch of stuff and bringing it to a shop to assemble is kinda like going to Safeway and buying bacon, eggs, and a loaf of bread and taking it to Denny’s and having them cook your breakfast. In the long run, building a relationship with a good machine shop will prove to be a valuable investment.

Spend money to get ceramic coated headers and install a crossover/H-pipe and run 2-1/2” through Flowmaster 40 series and dump beyond the rear bumper (under the car is nasty – stinks and just looks cheap).

Have fun and let us know what you come up with.

Regards,
Glenn

Just a thought, but as you total up your costs in machine work and parts, plus the time it usually takes waiting on parts and waiting for the machine shop, it often becomes more cost effective to get a crate engine and bolt it in, many of them even come with warranties now. I'm not trying to discourage you, just making a suggestion.

Originally Posted by glennsexton

Welcome to CHR:

Wagons can be cool hot rods - especially when equipped as sleepers that have a lot of get up and go. Your wagon weighs in at 4354 pounds and with a driver and fuel you’ll be pushing 4500 plus pounds so the 454 is a good choice for power. I think the cam that was recommended is a bit too big for any street application. The profile is 2,300 – 6,100 RPM which is way beyond the street if you’re going to stay with the 3.73 rear end. The COMP Cams CL11-600-8 has a 1,700 – 5,500 RPM range which is a lot closer to a boulevard bruiser and it will work much better with the 2.48 low gear ratio of the TH400.

I would also save a bunch of money on the rocker arms and go with the GM stamped steel 1.7 stock ratio. Unless you’re making your living running a ¼ mile roller rockers provide very little in the way of appreciable horsepower.

The TR2X manifold is a high winder and a beast over 6,000 RPM but a real dog at low (read street) RPM. I do not believe the HEI will work with this manifold and I’d be surprised if you stock hood would fit with this setup. Go with an Edelbrock Performer RPM(or similar dual plane manifold from Weiand or Holley) and a race prepped 800CFM Quadrajet or a similar size Holley. I really like the Quadrajet as the primaries are tame but when you hit those massive secondaries the sound is awesome and you catch a glimpse of God smiling down upon you. Holley is a good choice as well – I just really like the Quadrajet and when they’re set up correctly, they are hard to beat.

You need to square your block and put your reciprocating parts together and figure stack for compression before you pick heads (and head gaskets). Hopefully Tech Inspector will chime in with his tutorial on this critical step. Listen to him as he’s written books on this stuff and following his sage advice can save you a lot of heartburn, time and money.

As a suggestion: You mentioned that you’ll have the engine assembled – have you considered talking with your machinist and letting him recommend and provide the parts? Buying a bunch of stuff and bringing it to a shop to assemble is kinda like going to Safeway and buying bacon, eggs, and a loaf of bread and taking it to Denny’s and having them cook your breakfast. In the long run, building a relationship with a good machine shop will prove to be a valuable investment.

Spend money to get ceramic coated headers and install a crossover/H-pipe and run 2-1/2” through Flowmaster 40 series and dump beyond the rear bumper (under the car is nasty – stinks and just looks cheap).

Have fun and let us know what you come up with.

Regards,
Glenn

Glenn,

Thanks for the welcome and taking the time to respond. GREAT input! I really appreciate it. Your cam & rocker input sounds really reasonable and a better route to go with. I bought the setup from a fellow car club member, so the tunnel ram was part of it. Like I mentioned, I always wanted a blower setup, but shouldn't with this block and the tunnel ram is a true old school muscle and looks great sticking up out of the hood. Your input on the RPM range for it and it being a dog as a street application has caused me to have second thoughts. If it really comes to life above the 6k RPM range, that would not be seen for the most part and I did NOT know the HEI will not work on it. No way I want to go to the old setup with points. What I meant with the machinist was I was going to take the info to him, tell him what the Summit rep suggested and get his input (like I'm getting your guys input). I wasn't going to buy any parts until I have a good plan forward. Great input on the exhaust setup, I'll follow that.

Thanks again!!

Originally Posted by Dave Severson

Just a thought, but as you total up your costs in machine work and parts, plus the time it usually takes waiting on parts and waiting for the machine shop, it often becomes more cost effective to get a crate engine and bolt it in, many of them even come with warranties now. I'm not trying to discourage you, just making a suggestion.

Great suggestion. Other guys have mentioned that to me also. I started looking at crate engines...soooooooo many options

Glenn beat me to a reply. He always gives sound advice.!! I did want to re-iterate that if you are going to do a rebuild than definitely keep your machinist in the loop and heed his advise if you can, if there's any issues later and you want him to warranty anything, he may tell you "I told you so"! My only other thought would be to not use any "thumper" cam. It's old technology to run a cam with that much valve overlap and actually hurts performance for the street. A lot of folks call them "Poser" cams. All sound, no go.

I can't say I've known anyone to do a 90's wagon.. so it'll be different for sure. Oh, we also have a high requirement of pictures! So don't be bashful!! LOL

Originally Posted by 34_40

Glenn beat me to a reply. He always gives sound advice.!! I did want to re-iterate that if you are going to do a rebuild than definitely keep your machinist in the loop and heed his advise if you can, if there's any issues later and you want him to warranty anything, he may tell you "I told you so"! My only other thought would be to not use any "thumper" cam. It's old technology to run a cam with that much valve overlap and actually hurts performance for the street. A lot of folks call them "Poser" cams. All sound, no go.

I can't say I've known anyone to do a 90's wagon.. so it'll be different for sure. Oh, we also have a high requirement of pictures! So don't be bashful!! LOL

Thanks for your advice!! I appreciate it and will work close with the machinist. I'll look at the post for how to attach pics...

If you are interested in a Blown BBC-I know of a Mercruser supercharged complete Package that only has a couple hours----------

Couple pics. Old TBI motor and up on stands as I remove all the suspension. This will be a complete rebuild.

2.1.jpg13.jpg

@glennsexton You mentioned that you don't think the HEI will work with the tunnel ram, just for my info, why is that?

Dist too big to fit behind a tunnel ram------

Any thougths about the supercharged Mercruiser marine engine????

Originally Posted by jerry clayton

Dist too big to fit behind a tunnel ram------

Any thougths about the supercharged Mercruiser marine engine????

Ahh, ok that makes sense. Thanks.

What's a Mercrusier engine? You can message me the details and what you want for it. Give me something to think about.