Question about O-ringed block

Printable View

10-04-2008, 11:07 PM
outlaw hallett

Question about O-ringed block

I'm new to the big hp world of the bbc , but ill try to make this as short as pos. I bought a good 4 bolt block, it was o- ringed , I was told that i had to run copper head gaskets, I was also told that i did not need receiver groves in the dart aluminum heads, after the builder finished the short block, i final ass. the engine and ran it in my jet boat for the first time ,last week and i found that i had a lot of water coming out from between the heads and the block, so after talking to some people i pulled the heads and found he didn't put sealer between the copper gaskets and the head or block around the water ports,

so i did it the way i was told to and now i have no more water in the oil and everything is OK but i still have a drip or two coming out from between the head and block , but it is not going into the motor ,

My question is does anyone know if i have to have the heads grooved to receive the o-rings or not,, It is possible that i didnt put enough sealer around the water ports on the gaskets, as i was told that i should put on a fair amount , and i put a very fine layer to be safe , thanks for any input
10-04-2008, 11:57 PM
gassersrule_196

a buddy of mine always ran those copper headgaskets on his blown 468 and he always had coolant seepage issues he went to a fel pro gasket and it stopped. with o rings you do not need to run headgaskets?????
10-05-2008, 01:13 AM
outlaw hallett

im sorry did you say i dont need to run head gaskets?
10-05-2008, 01:36 AM
gassersrule_196

i was under that impression? a ford boss 429 uses o rings there are no headgakets. i am not sure.
10-05-2008, 02:01 AM
techinspector1

How far do the orings stand proud of the block deck? Realistically, copper will only displace about 10% of itself with an oring punching into it. In other words, if the ring stands proud by 0.006", then the copper gasket should be at least 0.060" thick to absorb the displacement of material in the gasket. I've never done a receiver ring in the heads, so don't know about that. Maybe Pat McCarthy will see this thread and respond.
10-05-2008, 07:17 AM
pat mccarthy

i do not use copper gaskets less the block is getting a repair then i will re cut the o ring groove .it is a pain in the A$$ if the block has them and you have to recut the deck that is no fun at all . a set of any of the new gaskets will work very good like the MLS or the ics titans i used the 1071-1 felpros and i have had very good luck with them holding .you should not need to cut the heads you need to coat the head gaskets with hylo mar but if they move they can leak i have engines with hi cr and a 500 shot of Nos and use the MLS cometic you did not say what you have for cr or blower nos? i talk guys out of the old copper gaskets if they put the oring wire up to hi you could try a thicker head gasket or pull the wire out and see if the fire ring on a mls gasket will not hang in the groove and just go to a mls gasket
10-05-2008, 10:02 AM
outlaw hallett

Quote:

Originally Posted by pat mccarthy

i do not use copper gaskets less the block is getting a repair then i will re cut the o ring groove .it is a pain in the A$$ if the block has them and you have to recut the deck that is no fun at all . a set of any of the new gaskets will work very good like the MLS or the ics titans i used the 1071-1 felpros and i have had very good luck with them holding .you should not need to cut the heads you need to coat the head gaskets with hylo mar but if they move they can leak i have engines with hi cr and a 500 shot of Nos and use the MLS cometic you did not say what you have for cr or blower nos? i talk guys out of the old copper gaskets if they put the oring wire up to hi you could try a thicker head gasket or pull the wire out and see if the fire ring on a mls gasket will not hang in the groove and just go to a mls gasket

thank you all, I'm running about 13:1 , I don't know about the height of the wire , but if I was to guess I would say 10 thou. above the deck , with 40 thou. gaskets like i said as long as its not going into the motor , i guess a drip or two is not going to hurt a boat ,, but it still think about it at night , I'm one of those people that it will bother me until i pull it apart and fix it , like I said before I think i may have not put enough sealer

did you say that i can run like a regular fel pro blue head gasket with o rings?
10-05-2008, 10:10 AM
pat mccarthy

Quote:

Originally Posted by outlaw hallett

thank you all, I'm running about 13:1 , I don't know about the height of the wire , but if I was to guess I would say 10 thou. above the deck , with 40 thou. gaskets like i said as long as its not going into the motor , i guess a drip or two is not going to hurt a boat ,, but it still think about it at night , I'm one of those people that it will bother me until i pull it apart and fix it , like I said before I think i may have not put enough sealer

did you say that i can run like a regular fel pro blue head gasket with o rings?

I HAVE BBC WITH 14TO5 WITH FEL PROS 1017-1 and 1017-2 along with 1057 i think i would not run wire and fel-pro gaskets it will leak for sure you would need to pull out the wire and make sure it will not hang up the fire ring on the felpros if you use any of the number s in my post
10-05-2008, 10:17 AM
outlaw hallett

Quote:

Originally Posted by pat mccarthy

I HAVE BBC WITH 14TO5 WITH FEL PROS 1017-1 and 1017-2 along with 1057 i think i would not run wire and fel-pro gaskets it will leak for sure you would need to pull out the wire and make sure it will not hang up the fire ring on the felpros if you use any of the number s in my post

well thanks again , i will probley just do that if i cant deal with it anymore, thanks again for your help
10-05-2008, 09:24 PM
jerry clayton

The copper gaskets need to be annealed so the wire can bite into the copper--I have used the Isky oring tool for years and used plain copper gaskets that I annealed and NEVER had any leakage---
10-06-2008, 05:42 AM
pat mccarthy

Quote:

Originally Posted by jerry clayton

The copper gaskets need to be annealed so the wire can bite into the copper--I have used the Isky oring tool for years and used plain copper gaskets that I annealed and NEVER had any leakage---

yes you can heat the gaskets up and put them in water to make the copper dead soft but should be if the rings are up to hi . he will need to go thicker head gaskets.i do not do a lot of O rings i only put them back in if the block needed a sleeve and i have to cut one in the sleeve i cut them with my F2b rottler it is not on the top on my list of things i like to do :D
10-06-2008, 07:18 PM
outlaw hallett

Quote:

Originally Posted by jerry clayton

The copper gaskets need to be annealed so the wire can bite into the copper--I have used the Isky oring tool for years and used plain copper gaskets that I annealed and NEVER had any leakage---

do you use sealer arround the water poets? thanks